Quote:
| Originally Posted by cgrosart The comment about cave diving's risks being manageable was made by Clive Westlake.
I don't think new, tourist cave divers should learn on CCR with OC bailout for the reasons that Clare Gledhill stated in her reply on the OTHER thread. In a nutshell, you need to know what you can/can't achieve on OC before you are forced to rely on it when your RB goes wrong. If you have an aversion to cave diving on OC, the only way I can see that learning to cave dive on CCR is acceptable is if you have CCR bailout.
I'll see you in France then  I think a cast of thousands are going to be helping Rick, which should keep him happy !
p.s He was only still working on his prototype nano-rebreather at the time of the Truffe push. We had to hear about it all the way down to the Lot.........  |
Why the hell you lot cant get your head around the fact I am talking from a personal perspective I have no idea. I mark chase feel more comfortable doing big wreck penetration or caves on a CCR. Having the extra gas in no way reduces the need for knowledge skill and caution. I believe time stress is a killer. Full stop
However I very much enjoy talking about diving and I learn a lot from the comments of more experienced divers so i am perfectly happy to stick my 10 hours of cave diving head above the parapet for your combined target practice. I might learn something and I am totally open to changing my view with further experience. I have done with CCR. The way i dive CCR now is totally different to the way i started and I wouldn't go back to my old ways.
Fire away.
The fact of the matter is the course is a CCR cave course and I dive a CCR so it seemed logical to do it. It doesn't qualify me to dive caves OC Id have to do another course for this.
The CCR course is different to the OC course specifically in the area of bailout
I find it an odd comment that there is any relevance at all to what can be achieved on OC in an emergency situation.
In my view very little can be achieved.
You either have enough gas or you don't. (You could breath the wing I suppose but thats got to be option Z and lets face it your using it as a SCR.)
CCR of course, is a totally different ball game. In board gas can be run semi closed. We have all been taught 4:1 ratio SCR. More experienced CCR divers have no doubt done what I have done and seen just how long it takes to breath down 1.3 to 0.4.
So on my inboard diluent I have the possibility of pushing my 3ltr with 150 bar in for 15mins minimum on a 4:1 and 20-25mins if i chose to run a diluent with a higher PP02 (which i would)
Then their's my off board 11.5 ltr 200 bar
My sac OC is around 12 working 8-10 resting. I generally gas plan on 15.
So OC bailout ignoring the CCR will give me an hours breathing gas.
Assuming stress virtually doubles my normal SAC to 20 I have 48mins
But i dive a CCR with a BOV so i can also run my diluent SCR as well so even with my raised SAC I now have 192mins
SO OC I have 48mins bailout CCR I have 207
BUT I hear you scream, what about a total unit flood?
Simple, Buy a unit that doesn't generally flood and has excellent flood recovery.
Much as i dislike the inspo it has fantastic flood recovery and would have avoided the problems I had on the KISS. I haven't dived a Meg in anger but seeing as it has a similar water trap system to the Inspo I would seriously consider a Copis MCCR Meg as a better choice than the KISS for this sort of diving.
So my conclusion as a total novice who dont know s#it about caves (but as a CCR diver with 4-500 hours experience) is that CCR greatly expands your options on bailout and straight OC bailout is both limited in application and of only limited significance to a CCR diver who dives the right unit.
Knowing what can be achieved on OC is a simple math question. I breath this much at this depth and I have that much gas. Allowing for stress i have X time. Thats about it isn't it? Why do i need another course to lern this, I did it in PADI AOW.
ATB
Mark