Variation on A Theme CD v OMS

[David Wallace]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (andyp @ Jan. 27 2004,23:56)]Skipper, I'm curious, it seems to me that the inflator has to me routed under the arm rather than over the shoulder,

Hi Andrew,

Bit difficult to explain in words, but basically if you are in a horizontal position the primary bladder is the bottom bladder and the elbow which enters the bladder is at the bottom of the wing (when viewd horozontally..........)

Normally you would expect the exit from the bladder to be at the highest part of the wing....... air goes up  

With the CD unless I was deliberatly overweight and had to much air..... dumping involved convincing the air to exit from the lowest part of the wing....... I used to talk nicely to it..... but no the laws of physics always won and dumping the last few litres of air alway invloved getting vertical either pulling the dump of lifting it up.

Ahh..... but you mention pull dumps.......... ask a service tech how many pull cords/ attachments are all stainless and how many go wrong    I used to like the convenience but now wonder why I ever thought I needed one!  more marketing issues I thinks  

Regards

[Andy Phillips]

Skipper,

Ah!, I see the problem, I don't know, but I have a sneeking suspicion that Chasey's is of a different design because he is able to dump whilst horizontal.

You will get no arguament from me about pull dumps, nasty mucky things they are, I have them on my wing, never used them, and unless there is a dire emergency, I never will.

Thanks,

Andrew

[Mark Chase]

No Dave (Skipper) is absolutly corect. The dump is on the front of the wing which would be the underside if you were horizontal in the water. The Halcyon dump is on the back of the wing which would be the top of the wing as viewed horizontal in the water.

I found it hard to dump the last of the air from my CD wing when I first got it but I cant say I notice a problem now. On the surface for decent I lean back and right a bit and this compleatley empties the wing.

During the dive you never need to compleatly empty the wing so its not an issue untill you get to Deco and need to stop at 6 with empty tanks. This can involve the non DIR going vertical to get the last dregs out of the wing or you can use the dump located at the bottom of the wing at the rear.

Doing most of my diving with stages and rareley if ever comming up with empty back gas and stage tanks I have always been negitave enough for this never to be an issue. My neutral weighting is on empty back gas with not aditional equipment or stages so with gas equipmnet and stages I am by necessity a couple of KG over at the end of a normal dive.

The Harnes on the CD TDB wing is an option. You can get it with no harn is and rig it with one piece webbing (as Dan has done) or you can get the BCD like Sports harnes or the standard CD tec harnes. I like the tec harnes some people dont. end of story. As for hypothetical failure points it has one quick release sholder clip thats it. I have never herd of a CD clip failing but if it did it hardly matters and the dive can be aborted without drama. I know this because I have tried it.

The D rings on the Tec harnes can be removed if you dont like them but the big 0 rings cant.

OK a few pics:

This shot of my old twin set set up shows the front profile of the wing harnes in use. As you can see it has one D ring on each side of the chest, These are on the end of the adjuster straps and one on each hip, hardley the alledged mass of D rings

[Mark Chase]

This pic shows the primary dump at the front of the wing and the second bladder dump (caped and not in use) at the rear left top of the wing.

[Mark Chase]

This close up of the top of the wing inflator shows that the design is best suited to pull dumping and not the PADI stile lift and dump. As pointed out these pull dumps can fail although I have never had a problem and I havent herd of one. The CD wing has a second dump so even if the primary should fail its not a terminal situation.

This pic also shows the mod that keeps the hose tidy sleve from covering the LP conectors

[Mark Chase]

This final pic shows the under arm routing of the wing inflator. The length of the wing inflator is IMHO best suited to this lay out.

I dont like the short wing inflator used on the Halcyon as it keeps the LP connector high up on the left chest / shoulder area. In the event of a free flows inflation of the wing it would be more difficult to access and disconnect the wing inflator hose in this position.

I also swapped the connector for the flanged Apex fitting to further facilitate a quick release.

[Dr Stevil]

Naturally I'm in agreement with Andy & Mark on this issue of wings, my wing does me for singles and twins no problem, and all this repetitively quoted stuff about getting a wing to fit around the cylinder... what the...  nonsense!

Funnily enough,  all the really experienced divers I know (ie those who can show you 1000's of logged dives and have a track record of advanced intruction, all manage very well without Halcyon wings...

[Gavin Yates]

<font color='#000F22'>I've got an Explorer and a Pioneer I like them both.

Are they any better than an OMS rig when set up properly ... for me yes cos I'm used to my kit.

For one of my regular buddies - probably not.

I'll stick with Halcyon as it is well made, performs well and is simplistic. It's best for me but not for everyone.

I've dived an OMS rig and a Dive Rite singles rig and thought they were both fine. I personally don't like the underarm inflator hose but my main buddy has no problems with it and that's ok with me.

Can we not just agree that the best way to make a choice is not be dogmatic but maybe offer to have a go on your rigs and let the guy decide for himself.

If any YDer fancies diving either a Halcyon Doubles or singles rig they are more than welcome.

[Andy Phillips]

Gavin,

I totally agree with you, the best solution is to try before you buy, to look at the issues, listen to opinions and buy what you deem to be best for you.

This was and is the source of my irritation, the mine is best with no reasoned arguament will always produce a reaction from me, mainly because it is unfair to the original poster.

If you happen to bring the Halcyon single rig up to Stoney I would love to have a look at it, curiosity and all that.

Andrew

[Mark]

<font color='#000080'>

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (andyp @ Jan. 28 2004,12:17)]
This was and is the source of my irritation, the mine is best with no reasoned arguament will always produce a reaction from me, mainly because it is unfair to the original poster.

Andy,

In my original reply I only said that it is best to get single purpose wings, not that Halcyon is best. If you don't agree then that's fair enough. It may be more expensive to do it that way but it is still the best way to go.

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]If you happen to bring the Halcyon single rig up to Stoney I would love to have a look at it, curiosity and all that.

I can bring an Explorer twin tank wing and s/steel backplate/harness for you to try if that's any good to you.

Regards,

Mark.