Alpine physco or not???

[colinicky]

I seem to remember reading recently that a manufacturer was developing a DSV with two loops attached to one DSV which could be swapped by turning a lever.

Yes made by Golem in the states think it includes OC bailout & to loops .

As for your buddy either he is upto the dive & can carry his own bailout or he can't & shouldn't be doing the dive with you ,again what is being proposed isn't true Alpinist as there are stages placed on a shot line so all you have to do is get yourself back to the shot !
The question arises on dives to 55-60 metres as to what the op would do if the shot is sent back to the surface by the last pair down & everybody is doing a free ascent with SMB ?

[BJ]

The nature of rebreather diving is that RB specific risks rebreather divers face are very quickly debilitating (hypoxia, CO2 hits, oxygen hits, cocktails). If you can do any form of recovery from such an event then you are doing extremely well.
Cheers,

Stuart

So don't kid yourself that the bail-out is going to save you. Prep. your unit so that it is 100 percent right - every time.

[gobfish1]

Yes made by Golem in the states think it includes OC bailout & to loops .

As for your buddy either he is upto the dive & can carry his own bailout or he can't & shouldn't be doing the dive with you ,again what is being proposed isn't true Alpinist as there are stages placed on a shot line so all you have to do is get yourself back to the shot !
The question arises on dives to 55-60 metres as to what the op would do if the shot is sent back to the surface by the last pair down & everybody is doing a free ascent with SMB ?

so will gaz have a set up diver with him to set his dive up for him ,
ie putting the stages on the shot for him .

think he is talking about diving the unit with just the two off board 3L
no one is droping twin set s off at the bottom of the shot ,
unless gaz is cos cant see some one else doing iit for him , can you .

one more thing if his buddy is diving along with gaz , and gaz s kit go's tits up is said buddy to pass gaz a bail out cylinder or watch him kick the can .

[Phoenix]

So don't kid yourself that the bail-out is going to save you. Prep. your unit so that it is 100 percent right - every time.

what a load of bollox, you can prep as much as you like but everything is fallible.

Ian

[colinicky]

The other interesting thing is that if we went back years when people dived single cylinders I bet there was the same debate about adding a pony as redundancy as well .

BJ
I don't know you & would not deem to judge anybody, but do you or are you willing to do all your diving to say 40m with only a single cylinder & no pony ? This would be deemed as diving the OC version of Alpinist surely ?

[Skiverdiver]

Gareth,

I am new to CCR and the Inspo in comparison to you and others on here giving their pearls of wisdom.

It does not really matter what I or others think - you have obviously thought this through and analysed the risks - the risks are obviously OK for you. For some these risks are not acceptable.....

I personally carry bail out (I'm a newbie! ), BUT I am a paranoid Engineer so I tend think as pre-checks like a car MOT - as soon as you get it out of the garage the exhaust COULD fall off! .....

This does not mean I disagree with your logic or risk analysis, but any risk is too much for me and the relatively small amount of bail out I carry would get me out of the water safe for the type of diving I do right now (35-45m)....

Also it is not always practical for people to get back to the shot and have bottles staged...certainly this is the case for the boats I dive off. Most of the boats I know lift the shot and we all come up on blobs....but then they are not 70-100m dives...

Great post and food for thought I think.....

ATB

Roy

[colinicky]

so will gaz have a set up diver with him to set his dive up for him ,
ie putting the stages on the shot for him .

think he is talking about diving the unit with just the two off board 3L
no one is droping twin set s off at the bottom of the shot ,
unless gaz is cos cant see some one else doing iit for him , can you .

one more thing if his buddy is diving along with gaz , and gaz s kit go's tits up is said buddy to pass gaz a bail out cylinder or watch him kick the can .

Sorry just reread whole thread & yes I was talking b******s about stages on line .

[Decodiver]

Too many good divers have been lost on CCR while weighed down with bail-out OC they never got to use.

Utter rubbish.

[Depth-junkie]

Gareth,

I am new to CCR and the Inspo in comparison to you and others on here giving their pearls of wisdom.

It does not really matter what I or others think - you have obviously thought this through and analysed the risks - the risks are obviously OK for you. For some these risks are not acceptable.....

I personally carry bail out (I'm a newbie! ), BUT I am a paranoid Engineer so I tend think as pre-checks like a car MOT - as soon as you get it out of the garage the exhaust COULD fall off! .....

This does not mean I disagree with your logic or risk analysis, but any risk is too much for me and the relatively small amount of bail out I carry would get me out of the water safe for the type of diving I do right now (35-45m)....

Also it is not always practical for people to get back to the shot and have bottles staged...certainly this is the case for the boats I dive off. Most of the boats I know lift the shot and we all come up on blobs....but then they are not 70-100m dives...

Great post and food for thought I think.....

ATB

Roy

As i said all dive failures excluding a full flood can be dealt with on the loop, i am not going to repeat old ground on my views of that.

OC works for shallow depths, but i bet the same faults that forced someone to go OC could have been dealt with on the loop (excluding a full flood) and we have already talked about how rare they are and the honest causes for them.

The question arises on dives to 55-60 metres as to what the op would do if the shot is sent back to the surface by the last pair down & everybody is doing a free ascent with SMB ?

In the 0.00000000001% chance of me getting a leak/flood at the end of my BT from 50-60m i still have the semi closed to get up shallow b4 the leak gets to bad and send the yellow bag to get a drop sent and i still have inboard Dil via auto air and inboard 02 via a reg bungied under my chin for some deco @ 6m (might get bent a bit but i would get out). the 02 reg attached to the inboard is the only reg on the rig excluding the auto air.

But as i honestly believe a set up/tested unit just dont give up the ghost and flood willy nilly. As i said there is a big difference between a leak and a full flood.

Any dives deeper than 70m tend to be back to the shot and deco station, so the same princables apply the only diference being that the shot already has bottles staged at various depths. So a leak at max depth still gives me plenty of time to get to the 1st of the deep bottles before the unit is renderd usless.

As i said before the use of OC bottles IMHO creates more problems % wise than the % of risk they can solve on deep dives.


ATB
Gareth

[Depth-junkie]

If i am diving a wreck @ 80m with no deco station or drop/staged tanks available, and there is also a diver carrying just his basic unit and 2x ali 80's of BT mix and 50% (no redundant 02 or PO2 monitor).

If we have both done 30-35 min BT's and both get a problem with the elecs failing or loss of use of solanoid (jamed open) or HP seat failure causing loss of inboard 02 (which in my mind are much more likey failure points than a flood) who do you think can complete the deco and dive safely???

The guy who only thinks OC bailout plan is the way forward any problem and he is off the unit too good old OC?? or is he deluding himself of the amount of gas needed for a full OC ascent and deco.

Or the guy who can stay on his unit and dont have the demishing gas supply problem???

As i said if i get a full flood at depth i am dead, simple as that. But i think i have enough safe measures to prevent this from happening. Or i would notice a major leak before i got any wear near 50m plus.






ATB
Gareth