Wreck mounting argon....don't really get it.

[Chris B]

I have seen both wreck and cave types of argon mountings for years now, and haven’t really considered either until Phil’s incident thread where some disadvantages of wreck mounting became clear (trapping the dump valve against the wreck argon bottle rendering it inoperable)

The wreck mounting was (If I remember correctly) originally conceived to facilitate easy removal for penetration of small holes….who honestly removes it to crawl in small holes? I'm guessing not many.

In reality it decreases width by approximately 5-6cm at one point on the profile. Who honestly regularly goes in such small holes that 5-6cm is going to make it a go no-go choice? I'm guessing not many.

For that matter, who honestly regularly stages cylinders to go in said holes? I'm guessing not many.

As for hydrodynamics. the wing covers the cave mounted cylinder anyway so smoothes out the already small profile (if you have even a single stage hydrodynamics is a moot point anyway)

I ferried 4 stages (3 leashed) yesterday and it did not interfere with leash or cylinder placement (the cave mounted cylinder is up and back out of the way)

Although I have never tried a wreck mounting; I imagined that this would create more clutter in the D-ring area. (Although I don’t know this)

The cave mounted 1.5lt bottle allows easy access to knob for shut down (it is almost where your hand naturally rests when scootering) and actually holds the wing dump valve in a convenient place to grab.

The 1.5lt cylinder lasts for a number of dives without needing re-filling. (easily a weekend)

In short, although I have 0 objection to wreck mountings….I have never really been able to see the up sides but still wonder why more people don't use the cave mount....I'm actually guessing trend following is more key than actual function.......?

Chris B

[EricF]

Chris,

I have used the doubles or "cave" style mounting with my 6 cu ft bottle. It was out of the way. Did my Fundy's class and was told you could get keyed that way (for wrecks) and they suggested it be moved to the waist (GI Version) or BP (AG Version). I have tried both - both seem ok. I have to lower the webbing loop on the BP and have the bottle sit a tad lower, on the waist strap, the bottle sits right behind the D-ring.

I think any of the three can work well. I guess the major question you need to ask, "can I get keyed with it here"?

http://www.divetekadventures.com/TechnicalARmounts.htm

Eric

[And]

Hi

I must admit I just used the same rig as that on the WKPP site, except I had the 1.5 ltr bottle and it was too big. I then got the small black APValves 1 ltr bottle but that is also too big. Finally got round to getting the 6cf (0.9 Ltr) bottle from the states and set it up AG style, basically because on boats the argon first stage gets bashed about. I can never say I've really felt it to be in the way although on the very few occasions when the wing is completely full it is harder to reach the dump, but not impossible.

I don't wear drycloves like some of you guys though and I think you are right in what you say Chris. If you use drygloves you cannot expect to rig your kit like Florida divers. The tankmount might be a better solution. Andy Kerslake tankmounts Argon. There's a hint

I'm going to the states in June and I think I might pick up a 14cf bottle and the mounting straps for tankmount.

I can understand the thoughts on getting keyholed, and after doing the bit of cave I have, anything which increases the size of your profile needs to have a compelling reason to be there.

Andy

[David Martin]

I have a 1L (AP valves) Ali bottle mounted wreck-style. I haven't found that it gets in the way of either the wing dump or the D-ring.

I've got an old-style 1L bottle (2001). The new style has thicker walls, and a significantly thicker diameter, and a slightly reduced length. It seems quite a lot bulkier.

If the bottle isn't bungied tightly to the plate, it can hang down a bit - which looks naff (we hadn't noticed this until DIR-F). The solution (other than small 6cuft bottles was to bungee it tighter. Putting the lower jubilee clip as near to the neck of the bottle as possible also helped.

The size of the argon reg is more important than on a cylinder mounted bottle - since the reg is very close to your waist/thigh. DS4s and Mk2s work well - Mk20/25 are too big.

The only real disadvantage that I can see to the wreck mounting is the maximum size If someone has others I'd be interested.

To stop it from slipping you need to keep the belt loop small - which can make moving it past the knife a bit of a pain. This isn't a problem on the surface, but the one time I tried it underwater I couldn't get it off. The combination of the small loop and the tight bungee round the neck of the bottle and not being able to see what I was doing caused problems. (I would have been able to had I cut the bungee but since I didn't need to get it off, I didn't want to do this.)

I've since decided to replace the loop with a velcro fixing (which I'm currently in the process of sewing). The jubilee clips will be in approximately the same place as before.

There will be three bits of webbing, joined by velcro, the middle one sitting betwen the other two. As per this diagram (ignore the dots if I just use spaces the lines don't start in the right place)

. . . . __________________
. . . / . __________________
___/___________________ . \______


This will make it easy to take on and off, whilst behaving like a simple single-piece loop when assemebled. Due credit for the idea must be given to Iain Smith - who's had a similar arrangement for a couple of years.

David

[iainmsmith]

Originally Posted by David Martin

There will be three bits of webbing, joined by velcro, the middle one sitting betwen the other two. As per this diagram (ignore the dots if I just use spaces the lines don't start in the right place)

. . . . __________________
. . . / . __________________
___/___________________ . \______


This will make it easy to take on and off, whilst behaving like a simple single-piece loop when assemebled. Due credit for the idea must be given to Iain Smith - who's had a similar arrangement for a couple of years.

:blush:

Actually, I stole the idea from George Irvine (who else!) whose setup was described on the page linked by Eric F above.

Iain

[David Martin]

I'd only ever seen the images on the WKKP site - which show a simple webbing loop - which I assumed was the "official" wreck mounting style.

http://www.wkpp.org/images/pina_equi..._argon3_r.jpeg

I admit that I didn't follow Eric's link - since I assumed that it would be the same.

Iain - I never knew that you'd copied George...any other "good ideas" that you want to own up to? :o

Davd

[lawrence]

Do any of those who've replaced a 1ltr bottle with 6cuft bottle want to sell said 1ltr? I'd be particularly interested in getting an old style (not thick) one if anybody has one to sell.

[Mark]

Originally Posted by lawrence

Do any of those who've replaced a 1ltr bottle with 6cuft bottle want to sell said 1ltr? I'd be particularly interested in getting an old style (not thick) one if anybody has one to sell.

I'll sell you my one. It's one of the dumpy black ones from Underwater Explorers.

It's in A1 condition as I have only used it a couple of times. They are £86 new so I'll take £50 for it.

Let me know.

Regards,

Mark.