Single piece of webbing for harness

[TerryH]

Right there are two examples.

One is on the HSE DVD - Diving Instructors - Roles, responsibilties & risk
assessments. Real incident (not a scenario) is about 30 minutes in.

The other trimix incident is on old duped video and I cant play it.
Will run it through one at Uni tommorrow night.

[Steve Summers]

Steve I guess you haven't tried to get out of one, which makes that statement rather pointless, unless of course you mean it's easier to hold on to the sides of the RIB while someone else unclips your harness - in which case should you be out in a force 7.

I agree but the weather at sea can change in a short time I've found over the years, and I have tried to get out of mine without opening the clip and struggled hence my asking of the 'how to' question. The only time I seen it done in a one piece was by a direr off a RIB in Whitby it was flat calm and he pulled it over it over his head.

Its a non-point.

If you are worried about being hit by a boat (during the 5 secs its going to take you to get out of your harness), then swim away from the boat, de-kit & get the boat to come around again. That's plain common-sense and applies if you are in a one-piece or not.

cheers,
Paul

it is a point with our wonderful boat handlers and it would give them an extra chance to run over you if a one piece works for you great I'm not knocking any divers choice as there is obviously more than one way to skin a cat.

Safe diving,
Steve

[scuba g]

Don't you just love YD - people who don't drive boats telling skippers how to do it - and people who don't dive one piece harnesses telling those who do why they don't work.

I personally dont dive a one piece, I have, but it didnt feel as comfortable as what I wear now, that doesnt mean its any better or less effective, just wasnt for me, I dive with divers who wear alot of different configurations, I get to know their gear and keep my rescue skills as sharp as possible, because when the sh*t hits the fan, the outcome of the rescue is rarely decicied if theres a clip or not, but the competency of the rescuer/s

It's right to give consideration to rescue when you set up your kit. It's responsible to consider how you would rescue your buddy, or how the boat will get you back on board in case of emergency.

Pre-dive check, and know how it works, I agree you need to make it a considerate task.

Rescuing people from the water is bloody hard and anyone who thinks that they have all the answers is just deluding themselves. Can I draw your attenion to Helen's report where a two man crew (well woman) dragged an unconsious diver from the water, couldn't locate a clip, used a D ring instead to winch the diver on board which broke off - I'm guessing it was sewn on. Frustrating, terrifying at the time I guess - hats off to Helen and Hazel for coping anyway with such a terrific outcome. (link here)

We cant choose who we rescue, we would like a text book senerio but you have to adapt to the task when it happens. For those who have done it, the effort and care in trying is commendable.

I'm not using this example to justify a one piece harness, or to justify D rings which aren't sewn on - just to point out that it's easy to sit at home and ponitficate that clips are better and easier to use - but on the day those who have to get you out may find otherwise. My harness can have as many breaks in it as you like in an emergency as it can be cut wherever necessary - but it will not break or fail until it's cut. I like it that way as I'm rather attached to having gas on my back stay there until I choose otherwise

The worest divers are one who have opinions but dont get wet to justify their thoughts, I make sure my skills and gear are up to the tasks needed to survive in the water and keep an open mind regarding opinions and comments, as they say "Everyday is a school day",

[neilh]

So the skipper was holding on for some time and
although tried, could not get the diver up.

So presumably the skipper was also unable to radio anyone nearby for assistance, etc? I'm not entirely sure whether you're arguing this is the case against a one piece harness or against boats with insufficient crew?

Typically fascinating YD thread though - carry on

[Woz]

I've just called and had a chat with a couple of other plymouth skippers and i think all 1 piece harness users will be safe down here. As they seem to know what they're doing with various bits of dive kit.

So i'd recommend you all come to Plymouth to dive, as apparently you're not safe if you dive elsewhere.

Good call! I shall cancel my Sound of Mull trip that I'm off to on Sat for a week.

[TerryH]

So presumably the skipper was also unable to radio anyone nearby for assistance, etc? I'm not entirely sure whether you're arguing this is the case against a one piece harness or against boats with insufficient crew?

Typically fascinating YD thread though - carry on

In the HSE/DVD incident, the skipper tied the diver onto the ladder and had
to wait until divers surfaced for assistance. All it said in the narration is that
he was unable to get the diver out of his gear and up the ladder.

Yes the skipper was solo, but then again an awful lot of boats are. So until
its mandatory that boats carry 2, i'd say the assumption should be that
there will be just the one trying to do the rescue.

I'm not anti-one piece and I can see its uses, just not sure of the usual
flawed diver logic. Seems to me that its only worth using a piece of kit,
when the circumstances dictate an advantage.

Cave, Multiples, scooter? Yep an advantage and not many boats around.
No Cave, No Mutiples and No scooter, but a solo skipper up top, well that
kinda in my book means that you need to think again.

[GLOC]

Cave, Multiples, scooter? Yep an advantage and not many boats around.
No Cave, No Mutiples and No scooter, but a solo skipper up top, well that
kinda in my book means that you need to think again.

Or choose your skippers accordingly

[neilh]

No Cave, No Mutiples and No scooter, but a solo skipper up top, well that
kinda in my book means that you need to think again.

Skipper with a knife on board then?

Seriously though - there must be more than a few people in the UK diving with one piece harnesses. If they were really that impossible to get people out of then wouldn't the HSE have waded in by now and stopped courses, instructors, etc using them? I'm just not convinced that it's that big an issue.

[GLOC]

I'm just not convinced that it's that big an issue.

Of course it is, otherwise we wouldn't have got 11 pages of posts in the DIR forum. Must be important

[Gary K]

Skipper with a knife on board then?

Seriously though - there must be more than a few people in the UK diving with one piece harnesses. If they were really that impossible to get people out of then wouldn't the HSE have waded in by now and stopped courses, instructors, etc using them? I'm just not convinced that it's that big an issue.

then again there must be millions of dives a year with people wearing kit with clips/breaks

when was the last time you heard an incident report stating the clip had broken?