Should there be an O2 set on Dive Charter Boats?

[resting rifleman]

in 20 odd years skippering, I have sent 3 dive pairs to the chamber after administering/providing o2, and also put 2 other individuals on o2 (mainly for my own peace of mind) one of whom had made a mix cock up (no mix,air, very extended deco) and another who had been grabbed by a panicking diver (from another group) who was minus weight belt, and doing the full polaris launch thing, bringing my bloke with him, this fellow dropped back to 10m and did full deco, but as he had a long drive that evening, it seemed wise, after consultation with cg, to get the o2 on the bash. it has never crossed my mind to charge for this, surely it is "duty of care".
we carry o2 as a first aid tool, you would'nt think of charging an old lady or a schoolchild, injured by the roadside, for the use of your mobile phone to call an ambulance. is there a difference?

[hopper]

Originally Posted by resting rifleman

we carry o2 as a first aid tool, you would'nt think of charging an old lady or a schoolchild, injured by the roadside, for the use of your mobile phone to call an ambulance. is there a difference?

If you look on O2 as a first aid tool and are happy to adminster it this way then fair enough, however if the only way to get a skipper to carry O2 was to pay for the use of it then I for 1 would be happy to pay a deposit and have it onboard rather than not.

My suggestion was more aimed at the posts I had read where people reported the "misuse" of it i.e

Originally Posted by Yellow Butty Box

on a different note there is a new trend starting to rear its head regarding 02.
its called a free snort.
usually follows "had a fast ascent skip i'd better go on 02"
"no problem its ready to go help yourself ", keeping a close eye on things
2 hours later and 1 empty 02 cylinder "whats the next wreck called skip?"
errmm yeah right
ring any bells?

If you provode O2 completely free of charge then I commend you for supplying a service that would appear to be extra above and beyond what is currently legally required and as such I hope your customer recognise this.

[resting rifleman]

perhaps its because as part of the skippers briefing, we notify all divers that if they feel that they NEED o2 then they will also get a heli ride to the pot.

[Angleseyskipper]

we dive on a regular basis as well hopper so every one benifits from having a full cylinder of the good stuff on board .
insurance for those rare half a crown sixpence moments!.
cheers elfyn

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by resting rifleman

perhaps its because as part of the skippers briefing, we notify all divers that if they feel that they NEED o2 then they will also get a heli ride to the pot.

1/2 of me is not impressed at ALL by this common Skipper statement and 1/2 of me reckons divers should take some responsibility for them selves and stop expecting others to sort it.

I prefer to get back on the boat sucking 02 and sit sucking 02 (on loop these days) for a while (quite a while after a big dive) and it is common for skippers to ask me if I am OK. Those that know me know this is normal for me so they don’t give it a second thought.

If I have a pain or an ache I will stay on 02 until I am convinced either way as to what the problem is. Being 40 and fat I often have aches and pains.

For this reason if I am on the boats 02 I definitely NEED a helicopter ride.

HOWEVER

I hate to think a Scooby doo is sitting there thinking I should be on 02 but I don’t want to make a fuss and I don’t want a helicopter ride, who is going to sort my kit, who is going to sort my car, how will I get back to the car after I am discharged? Realistically these are the stupid thoughts that an in denial diver will have. Perversely they are not in denial that their hurting / bent there in denial that it's serious enough to weren’t the hassle.

Serious physical damage could be obverted if divers went for the 02 without a second thought. There should be no negative pressure and actually divers should be actively encouraged to " if in doubt suck 02". I sympathise with the skippers who are seething inside thinking why cant these Muppets sort THEMSELVES out I actually couldn’t agree more, but think of it as your good dead for the day.

ATB

Mark Chase

[Hazel W]

Ok mark

I have put divers on o2 as a precaution without insisting they take a ride to the pot ..... and i think this get a positive response from divers ....( and i dont charge for the o2)

I dont think of it as a good deed but as part of the service i provide, i would resent a diver taking advantage of this by asking to dive later ( against the "advice " i would give him or her.)
Skippers obviously take an individual view of this but i would say that it is a common practice here. In fact due us getting many divers here for a weeks diving ...not just a day, we get to know individuals very well ... and know their routines and we are often able to spot out of character actions such as u have described.


Hazel

[hopper]

Originally Posted by Mark Chase

Serious physical damage could be obverted if divers went for the 02 without a second thought. There should be no negative pressure and actually divers should be actively encouraged to " if in doubt suck 02".

Before I give go any further, I have been on the GIN and if I am missing something here its Gordons fault!!

Who should supply this O2? Lets not forget that we have been talking in this and another thread about "Water Taxi's" etc.

Do you expect your Friday Night Taxi Driver on your way home form town to supply you with chilli sauce for your Kebab? - No, I doubt it.

So who should suply this O2? If you want it to be encouraged, don't the divers have to pay for it? Fine let everyone have it after a dive, no matter how deep or long, but who foots the bill?

I suppose if i'm being truthful my beef isn't about who pays for the O2 but will there will be some there for me when or if I need it? If its free, it WILL/may be used and abused, as was said in a post earlier, "a cylinder of O2 later" etc. My logic is if a diver has to pay for the O2 he/she is less likley to abuse it.

As resting rifleman said, he sees O2 as a FIRST AID TOOL, how may people abuse the first aid kit at work etc, not many, but it would appear that most if not all the skippers here have seen an incident of O2 abuse.

[Andy the Coastie]

Originally Posted by hopper

but it would appear that most if not all the skippers here have seen an incident of O2 abuse.

Not this skipper ,,,,,, not on the Taurus.........


But have seen it elsewhere, even seen it used for waking people up on a early morning dive

[resting rifleman]

HOWEVER

"I hate to think a Scooby doo is sitting there thinking I should be on 02 but I don’t want to make a fuss and I don’t want a helicopter ride, who is going to sort my kit, who is going to sort my car, how will I get back to the car after I am discharged? Realistically these are the stupid thoughts that an in denial diver will have. Perversely they are not in denial that their hurting / bent there in denial that it's serious enough to weren’t the hassle."

denial is denial, thats what buddies are for! and alarms on puters, ANY symptoms should be made known at the earliest moment. as per briefing!"


"Serious physical damage could be obverted if divers went for the 02 without a second thought. There should be no negative pressure"

if being put in the hands of dci pro's is negative I'm all for it.

"and actually divers should be actively encouraged to " if in doubt suck 02"."

and thereby self medicate untill symptoms desist? those are they whose symptoms manifest a couple of days later, and find themselves in the pot (or worse) where they should have gone immediately for a proper assesment.

"I sympathise with the skippers who are seething inside thinking why cant these Muppets sort THEMSELVES out I actually couldn’t agree more, but think of it as your good dead for the day."

any diver can get a dci,i'm pretty sure it isnt exclusive to "muppets", as far as i know, there aint a skipper in the world qualified to fix one! but i know a man who can, this helicopter will take you to him.(my good deed for the day)

[Mark Chase]

I have seen a few bent divers. They were laying flat out on the floor there was no argument about errr I wonder if I am bent. I have also seen divers (been on my self) with a sholder pain for example who are trying to decide wether or not there bent. Its the latter group we are talking about here.

The experinced / trained diver will get on 02 and if the pain goes away or is reduced he (or if he's not thinking streight, his buddy) will know its a bend and summon help. If the pain stays and dosent get any worse it likley to be a strain. If it clears up and then comes back again once your off 02 its likley a bend. Its not rocket science.

ATB

Mark Chase