At the risk of sounding dumb!

[Hazel W]

Originally Posted by Mal Bridgeman

eh...A BRA is what yer keep yer t*ts in innit
Mal

yup.... unless provoked !






what do you keep yours in?



H

[Mal Bridgeman]

Originally Posted by Hazel W

what do you keep yours in?

[TerryH]

Hate to say this, but my claim to fame is that I was the one who put BRA
on the original Dive Instruct list which can now be found here and has migrated it seems to a few others.

Useful Lists - BSACWiki

Ok its not the smutty awnser you lot want, but if you think about it,
it's more logical to go top > down, Buoyancy (BC), Releases (BC again)
and then Air.

PADI sort of have the hang of it by doing Buoyancy Weights Releases Air
(forget Final OK we do that anyway, its polite).

Bet they stuck that W in there to be PC :-)

[Aerodive]

Originally Posted by TerryH

Hate to say this, but my claim to fame is that I was the one who put BRA
on the original Dive Instruct list which can now be found here and has migrated it seems to a few others.

Useful Lists - BSACWiki

Ok its not the smutty awnser you lot want, but if you think about it,
it's more logical to go top > down, Buoyancy (BC), Releases (BC again)
and then Air.

PADI sort of have the hang of it by doing Buoyancy Weights Releases Air
(forget Final OK we do that anyway, its polite).

Bet they stuck that W in there to be PC :-)

Ahem.......
I was taught to remember it as Blonde Women Really Are Fun!
and the final ok is polite in case you never see each other alive again!

(at least i remembered it)

[Jules]

naaa
Everyone knows it's
Big Willies Really Are Fun

[SilvaFish]

Originally Posted by Hazel W

some of these might be helpful .....



AA Assisted Ascent
AAS Alternative Air Source
ABC Airway, Breathing, Circulation
ABT Actual Bottom Time
ABLJ Adjustable Buoyancy Life Jacket
ACI Assistant Club Instructor (BSAC)
ACUC American Canadian Underwater Certification
AD Advanced Diver (BSAC)
AD Adventure Diver (PADI)
AED Automatic Emergency Defibrillator See also PAD
AI Assistant Instructor (PADI)?
AIW Advanced Instructor Workshop?
AND Advanced Nitrox Diver?
ANDI American Nitrox Divers International?
AOW Advanced Open Water (PADI)
AP Ambient Pressure?
AR Ascent Rate?
ASDA Advanced Scuba Diving Association?
ATA Atmospheres Absolute
ATM Atmosphere?
AV Artificial Ventilation?
AVPU Alert, Voice, Pain, Unresponsive (simplified consciousness assessment)
BA Breathing Apparatus
BAR Buoyancy Air Releases (BSAC)?
BARF Buoyancy, Air, Releases, Fins
BARZ Buoyancy Air Releases ZIPS! (Drysuits)?
BC Buoyancy Control?
BCD Buoyancy Control Device?
BDO Branch Diving Officer
BHA British Hyperbaric Association
BMA British Medical Association
BMJ British Medical Journal
BP Backplate, also Blood Pressure
BPM Beats Per Minute (heart/pulse rate)
BW Backplate and Wing?
BRA Buoyancy Releases Air?
BS British Standard?
BSI British Standards Institute
BSAC British Sub Aqua Club
BSOUP British Society Of Underwater Photographers?
BT Bottom Time
BWRAF Begin With Review and Friend
BWRAF Buoyancy Weights Releases Air Final OK (PADI)
CADC Canadian Association of Diving Contractors?
CAGE Cerebral Arterial Gas Embolism?
CBL Controlled Buoyant Lift
CBPDS Conf. Brasileanos de Pesca e Desportos Subaquaticos?
CC Cardiac Compressions
CCR Closed Circuit Rebreather
CD Club Diver (BSAC)
CD Course Director (PADI)
CDAA Cave Divers Association of Australia?
CDG-GB Cave Diving Group of Great Britain?
CEN Comite? Europenne de Normalization (The European Committee for Standardisation)
CESA Controlled Emergency Swimming Ascent?
CI Club Instructor (BSAC)?
CIE Club Instructor Exam (BSAC)?
CIPP Compagnie des Instructeurs Professionnels de Plongee?
CMAS Confederation Mondiale des Activities Subaquatiques (World Underwater Federation)
CNS Central Nervous System
CO Carbon Monoxide
CO Cardiac Output
CO2 Carbon Dioxide
CPR Cardio Pulmonary Resuscitation
CWDI Canadian Working Divers Institute
DAN Diver's Alert Network
DCI Decompression Illness
DC or DCC Decompression Computer
DCS Decompression Sickness
DCS Dive Control Specialist (SSI)
DDEMS Defence Diver Extended Medical Skills (British Forces Qualification)
DDRC Diving Diseases Research Centre
DEMA Diving Equipment and Marketing Association
DER Depth Experience Record
DIN Deutsches Institut f?r Normung e.V. (German Institute for Standardization)
DIR Do(ing) It Right
DIW Doing It Wrong
DL Dive Leader (BSAC)
DM Divemaster (PADI)
DM Dive Marshal
DO Diving Officer
DOD Department of Defense (US)
DOT Department of Transportation
DPV Diver Propulsion Vehicle
DRABC Danger, Response, Airway, Breathing, Circulation (casualty assessment)
DRI Dive Rescue International
DS Decompression Sickness?
DSAT Diving Science and Technology(PADI)
DSC Digital Selective Calling
DSF Dansk Sportsdykker Forbund (Danish Sport Diving Federation)
DSMB Delayed Surface Marker Buoy
DT Dive Time
DTR Digital Time Recorder
DUI Divers Unlimited International
DV Demand Valve
DWR97 Diving at Work Regulations 1997 (UK legislation)
CEDIP European Committee of Professional Diving Instructors
EAD Equivalent Air Depth?or Effective Air Depth
EAR Expired Air Resuscitation.... superceded by AV
EANX Enriched Air Nitrox
ECM External Cardiac Massage (term superceded by CC)
END Equivalent Narcotic Depth
EO Equipment Officer
EPIRB Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacon
ERC European Resuscitation Council
ERD Extended Range Diver (BSAC)
ESDA Emergency Services Diving Association
FAD First Aid for Divers
FCD First Class Diver (BSAC)
FCD Freeflow Control Device
FEDAS Federacion Espanola De Actividades Subacuaticas
FEV(1) Forced Expiratory Volume (in one second)
FFESSM F?d?ration Fran?aise d'Etudes et de Sports Sous Marins?
FSSS F?d?ration Suisse de Sports Subaquatiques
FQAS F?d?ration Qu?becoise des Activites Subaquatiques
GMDSS Global Maritime Distress and Safety System
GPS Global Positioning System
GUE Global Underwater Explorers
HID High Intensity Discharge
HDS Historical Diving Society
HE Helium
HMCG Her Majesty's Coast Guard
HSA Handicapped Scuba Association?
HSE Health & Safety Executive
HSW Act or HSWA74 Health and Safety at Work etc. Act 1974 (UK legislation)
IADRS International Association of Dive Rescue Specialists
IAHD International Association for Handicapped Divers
IANTD International Association of Nitrox and Technical Divers
IDC Instructor Development Course (PADI)
IDEA International Diving Educators Association
IDEST Inspectorate for Diving Equipment Servicing and Testing
IDOT Israeli Dive Operators and Tourism
IOC Instructor Orientation Course (PADI)
ISO International Standards Organisation
ITC Instructor Training Course (BSAC)
ITS Instructor Training Scheme?(BSAC)
ITW Instructor Training Workshop?(BSAC)
JAMA The Journal of the American Medical Association
JSSADC Joint Services Sub Aqua Diving Clubs
KISS Keep It Simple, Stupid
LIDS London International Dive Show
MCA Maritime and Coastguard Agency
MCQ Multiple Choice Questionnaire (also known as Multiple Choice Paper)
MCS Marine Conservation Society
MDEA Multinational Diving Educators Association
MFA Medic First Aid (PADI)?
MFS Mask Fin Snorkel
MI Master Instructor (PADI)
MMSI Maritime Mobile Service Identity
MRCC Maritime Rescue Coordination Centre
MRSC Maritime Rescue Sub Centre
MSD Master Scuba Diver (PADI)
MSDT Master Scuba Diver Trainer (PADI)
NACD National Association of Cave Divers
NAS Nautical Archaeological Society
NASDS National Association of SCUBA Diving Schools
NASE National Association of Scuba Educators
NAUI National Association of Underwater Instructors
NBDHMT National Board of Diving & Hyperbaric Medical Technology
NDF Norwegian Diving Federation
NDO National Diving Officer (BSAC)
NDO National Diving Officer?(SAA)
NDO National Diving Officer?(SSAC)
NEDU Navy Experimental Diving Unit (US Navy)
NELOS Nederlandstalige liga voor onderwateronderzoek en -sport (Belgium)?
NEC National Exhibition Centre
NHC National Hyperbaric Centre (Aberdeen)
NI National Instructor (BSAC)
NIADD National Instructors' Assn for Divers with Disabilities
NN Nitrogen Narcosis
NO Nitrox
NOAA National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration
NOB Nederlandse Onderwatersport Bond
NQI Nationally Qualified Instructor
O2 Oxygen
OA/O2A Oxygen Administration
OAC Oxygen Administration Course
OD Ocean Diver (BSAC)
OPV Over Pressure Valve
OT Oxygen Toxicity
OWI Open Water Instructor (BSAC)
OWIC Open Water Instructor Course (BSAC)
OWSI Open Water Scuba Instructor (PADI)
PADI Professional Association of Diving Instructors
PAD Public Access Defibrillator (American term for AED)?
PBA Professional Boatmans Association
PDIC Professional Diving Instructors Corporation
PFO Patent Foramen Ovale
PNR Passenger Name Record
PP Partial Pressure
PPP Planning Preparation Presentation
PPPPPP Perfect Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance
PRM Practical Rescue Management (BSAC)
PSA Professional Scuba Association
PSDA Public Safety Diving Association
PSI Pounds per Square Inch?
PSI Professional Scuba Inspectors inc
QA Quality Assurance
QRB Qualification Record Book
RA Rescue Assessment
RAC Rebreather Awareness Course
RDP Recreational Dive Planner (PADI)
REAP Review Encourage Assess Plan
REG Regulator
RES Rescue Diver (PADI)
RFA Rescue First Aid
RIB Rigid hulled Inflatable Boat
RhIB Rigid Hulled Inflatable Boat
RLSS Royal Life Saving Society
RMV Respiratory Minute Volume
RNLI Royal National Lifeboat Institution
RNPL Royal Navy Physiological Laboratory (produced RN decompression tables)
RNT Residual Nitrogen Time
ROV Remotely Operated Vehicle
RSTC Recreational Scuba Training Council
RYA Royal Yachting Association
SAA Sub Aqua Association
SADS Sub Aqua Diving Supervisor (Joint Services Sub-Aqua Diving Clubs
SALT Statement of Alternative Level Training
SAR Search and Rescue
SBS Special Boat Service (Royal Navy special forces)
SC Surfacing Code
SCR Semi-closed Circuit Rebreather?
SCUBA Self Contained Underwater Breathing Apparatus
SEAL Sea-Air-Land Teams (US Navy special forces)
SEEDS Safety Equipment Exercise Discipline Signals
SD Sports Diver (BSAC)
SDC Skill Development Course (BSAC)
SDCC Skill Development Course Certificate (BSAC)
SDI SCUBA Diving International
SI Surface Interval
SITA Scuba Industries Trade Association
SLJ Surface Life Jacket
SMB Surface Marker Buoy
SOLAS Safety of Life at Sea
SPG Submersible Pressure Gauge
SAR Search & Rescue
SUF Swedish Underwater Federation
SSAC Scottish Sub Aqua Club
SSI Scuba Schools International
STA Scuba Trade Association
SUSL Finnish Sportdivers Association
SWA Sheltered Water Assessment
SWP Safe Working Pressure
SWMBO She Who Must Be Obeyed
TBT Total Bottom Time
TD Technical Diver
TDI Technical Diving International
TIDF The Israeli Diving Federation
TLA Three Letter Acronym
TO Training Officer
TP Test Pressure
TPR Transportable Pressure Receptacle
TSM Technical Support Manager
TTS time to surface
TSV Tauchsportverband Oesterreichs (Austrian Diving Federation)
UDT Underwater Demolition Team
UHMS Undersea and Hyperbaric Medical Society
UPTD Unit Pulmonary Toxic Dose
UBA Underwater Breathing Apparatus
V Visual (Inspection of air cylinder for test purposes)
VDST Verband deutscher Sporttaucher e.V. (German Sport Diving Club)?
VDTL Verband deutscher Tauchlehrer e.V. (German Dive Instructor Agency)?
VPM Varying Permeability model
VVDS Variable Volume Drysuit
WASI World Association of Scuba Instructors?
WB Weightbelt
WP Water Pressure also Working Pressure
WKPP Woodville Karst Plains Project?
YBOD Yellow Box Of Death (a rather cruel and unfair reference to the Inspiration CCR)
YMCA Young Men's Christian Association


Hazel

HIB Hazel Is Bored
BWRAF Bangkok Women Really Are Fellas

[Scubee]

Bankok women Really Are Fellas



(didn't we do this one a little while ago?)

EDIT: note to self - read whole thread before posting

[Paul Oliver]

Hazel, your list is rubbish, DUE is not on there

[Andy the Coastie]

Originally Posted by Hazel W

some of these might be helpful .....



AA Assisted Ascent
AAS Alternative Air Source
ABC Airway, Breathing, Circulation
ABT Actual Bottom Time
ABLJ Adjustable Buoyancy Life Jacket
ACI Assistant Club Instructor (BSAC)
ACUC American Canadian Underwater Certification
AD Advanced Diver (BSAC)
AD Adventure Diver (PADI)
AED Automatic Emergency Defibrillator See also PAD
AI Assistant Instructor (PADI)?
AIW Advanced Instructor Workshop?
AND Advanced Nitrox Diver?
ANDI American Nitrox Divers International?
AOW Advanced Open Water (PADI)
AP Ambient Pressure?
AR Ascent Rate?
ASDA Advanced Scuba Diving Association?
ATA Atmospheres Absolute
ATM Atmosphere?
AV Artificial Ventilation?
AVPU Alert, Voice, Pain, Unresponsive (simplified consciousness assessment)
BA Breathing Apparatus
BAR Buoyancy Air Releases (BSAC)?
BARF Buoyancy, Air, Releases, Fins
BARZ Buoyancy Air Releases ZIPS! (Drysuits)?
BC Buoyancy Control?
BCD Buoyancy Control Device?
BDO Branch Diving Officer
BHA British Hyperbaric Association
BMA British Medical Association
BMJ British Medical Journal
BP Backplate, also Blood Pressure
BPM Beats Per Minute (heart/pulse rate)
BW Backplate and Wing?
BRA Buoyancy Releases Air?
BS British Standard?
BSI British Standards Institute
BSAC British Sub Aqua Club
BSOUP British Society Of Underwater Photographers?
BT Bottom Time
BWRAF Begin With Review and Friend
BWRAF Buoyancy Weights Releases Air Final OK (PADI)
CADC Canadian Association of Diving Contractors?
CAGE Cerebral Arterial Gas Embolism?
CBL Controlled Buoyant Lift
CBPDS Conf. Brasileanos de Pesca e Desportos Subaquaticos?
CC Cardiac Compressions
CCR Closed Circuit Rebreather
CD Club Diver (BSAC)
CD Course Director (PADI)
CDAA Cave Divers Association of Australia?
CDG-GB Cave Diving Group of Great Britain?
CEN Comite? Europenne de Normalization (The European Committee for Standardisation)
CESA Controlled Emergency Swimming Ascent?
CI Club Instructor (BSAC)?
CIE Club Instructor Exam (BSAC)?
CIPP Compagnie des Instructeurs Professionnels de Plongee?
CMAS Confederation Mondiale des Activities Subaquatiques (World Underwater Federation)
CNS Central Nervous System
CO Carbon Monoxide
CO Cardiac Output
CO2 Carbon Dioxide
CPR Cardio Pulmonary Resuscitation
CWDI Canadian Working Divers Institute
DAN Diver's Alert Network
DCI Decompression Illness
DC or DCC Decompression Computer
DCS Decompression Sickness
DCS Dive Control Specialist (SSI)
DDEMS Defence Diver Extended Medical Skills (British Forces Qualification)
DDRC Diving Diseases Research Centre
DEMA Diving Equipment and Marketing Association
DER Depth Experience Record
DIN Deutsches Institut f?r Normung e.V. (German Institute for Standardization)
DIR Do(ing) It Right
DIW Doing It Wrong
DL Dive Leader (BSAC)
DM Divemaster (PADI)
DM Dive Marshal
DO Diving Officer
DOD Department of Defense (US)
DOT Department of Transportation
DPV Diver Propulsion Vehicle
DRABC Danger, Response, Airway, Breathing, Circulation (casualty assessment)
DRI Dive Rescue International
DS Decompression Sickness?
DSAT Diving Science and Technology(PADI)
DSC Digital Selective Calling
DSF Dansk Sportsdykker Forbund (Danish Sport Diving Federation)
DSMB Delayed Surface Marker Buoy
DT Dive Time
DTR Digital Time Recorder
DUI Divers Unlimited International
DV Demand Valve
DWR97 Diving at Work Regulations 1997 (UK legislation)
CEDIP European Committee of Professional Diving Instructors
EAD Equivalent Air Depth?or Effective Air Depth
EAR Expired Air Resuscitation.... superceded by AV
EANX Enriched Air Nitrox
ECM External Cardiac Massage (term superceded by CC)
END Equivalent Narcotic Depth
EO Equipment Officer
EPIRB Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacon
ERC European Resuscitation Council
ERD Extended Range Diver (BSAC)
ESDA Emergency Services Diving Association
FAD First Aid for Divers
FCD First Class Diver (BSAC)
FCD Freeflow Control Device
FEDAS Federacion Espanola De Actividades Subacuaticas
FEV(1) Forced Expiratory Volume (in one second)
FFESSM F?d?ration Fran?aise d'Etudes et de Sports Sous Marins?
FSSS F?d?ration Suisse de Sports Subaquatiques
FQAS F?d?ration Qu?becoise des Activites Subaquatiques
GMDSS Global Maritime Distress and Safety System
GPS Global Positioning System
GUE Global Underwater Explorers
HID High Intensity Discharge
HDS Historical Diving Society
HE Helium
HMCG Her Majesty's Coast Guard
HSA Handicapped Scuba Association?
HSE Health & Safety Executive
HSW Act or HSWA74 Health and Safety at Work etc. Act 1974 (UK legislation)
IADRS International Association of Dive Rescue Specialists
IAHD International Association for Handicapped Divers
IANTD International Association of Nitrox and Technical Divers
IDC Instructor Development Course (PADI)
IDEA International Diving Educators Association
IDEST Inspectorate for Diving Equipment Servicing and Testing
IDOT Israeli Dive Operators and Tourism
IOC Instructor Orientation Course (PADI)
ISO International Standards Organisation
ITC Instructor Training Course (BSAC)
ITS Instructor Training Scheme?(BSAC)
ITW Instructor Training Workshop?(BSAC)
JAMA The Journal of the American Medical Association
JSSADC Joint Services Sub Aqua Diving Clubs
KISS Keep It Simple, Stupid
LIDS London International Dive Show
MCA Maritime and Coastguard Agency
MCQ Multiple Choice Questionnaire (also known as Multiple Choice Paper)
MCS Marine Conservation Society
MDEA Multinational Diving Educators Association
MFA Medic First Aid (PADI)?
MFS Mask Fin Snorkel
MI Master Instructor (PADI)
MMSI Maritime Mobile Service Identity
MRCC Maritime Rescue Coordination Centre
****** MRSC Maritime Rescue Sub Centre ***********
MSD Master Scuba Diver (PADI)
MSDT Master Scuba Diver Trainer (PADI)
NACD National Association of Cave Divers
NAS Nautical Archaeological Society
NASDS National Association of SCUBA Diving Schools
NASE National Association of Scuba Educators
NAUI National Association of Underwater Instructors
NBDHMT National Board of Diving & Hyperbaric Medical Technology
NDF Norwegian Diving Federation
NDO National Diving Officer (BSAC)
NDO National Diving Officer?(SAA)
NDO National Diving Officer?(SSAC)
NEDU Navy Experimental Diving Unit (US Navy)
NELOS Nederlandstalige liga voor onderwateronderzoek en -sport (Belgium)?
NEC National Exhibition Centre
NHC National Hyperbaric Centre (Aberdeen)
NI National Instructor (BSAC)
NIADD National Instructors' Assn for Divers with Disabilities
NN Nitrogen Narcosis
NO Nitrox
NOAA National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration
NOB Nederlandse Onderwatersport Bond
NQI Nationally Qualified Instructor
O2 Oxygen
OA/O2A Oxygen Administration
OAC Oxygen Administration Course
OD Ocean Diver (BSAC)
OPV Over Pressure Valve
OT Oxygen Toxicity
OWI Open Water Instructor (BSAC)
OWIC Open Water Instructor Course (BSAC)
OWSI Open Water Scuba Instructor (PADI)
PADI Professional Association of Diving Instructors
PAD Public Access Defibrillator (American term for AED)?
PBA Professional Boatmans Association
PDIC Professional Diving Instructors Corporation
PFO Patent Foramen Ovale
PNR Passenger Name Record
PP Partial Pressure
PPP Planning Preparation Presentation
PPPPPP Perfect Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance
PRM Practical Rescue Management (BSAC)
PSA Professional Scuba Association
PSDA Public Safety Diving Association
PSI Pounds per Square Inch?
PSI Professional Scuba Inspectors inc
QA Quality Assurance
QRB Qualification Record Book
RA Rescue Assessment
RAC Rebreather Awareness Course
RDP Recreational Dive Planner (PADI)
REAP Review Encourage Assess Plan
REG Regulator
RES Rescue Diver (PADI)
RFA Rescue First Aid
RIB Rigid hulled Inflatable Boat
RhIB Rigid Hulled Inflatable Boat
RLSS Royal Life Saving Society
RMV Respiratory Minute Volume
RNLI Royal National Lifeboat Institution
RNPL Royal Navy Physiological Laboratory (produced RN decompression tables)
RNT Residual Nitrogen Time
ROV Remotely Operated Vehicle
RSTC Recreational Scuba Training Council
RYA Royal Yachting Association
SAA Sub Aqua Association
SADS Sub Aqua Diving Supervisor (Joint Services Sub-Aqua Diving Clubs
SALT Statement of Alternative Level Training
SAR Search and Rescue
SBS Special Boat Service (Royal Navy special forces)
SC Surfacing Code
SCR Semi-closed Circuit Rebreather?
SCUBA Self Contained Underwater Breathing Apparatus
SEAL Sea-Air-Land Teams (US Navy special forces)
SEEDS Safety Equipment Exercise Discipline Signals
SD Sports Diver (BSAC)
SDC Skill Development Course (BSAC)
SDCC Skill Development Course Certificate (BSAC)
SDI SCUBA Diving International
SI Surface Interval
SITA Scuba Industries Trade Association
SLJ Surface Life Jacket
SMB Surface Marker Buoy
SOLAS Safety of Life at Sea
SPG Submersible Pressure Gauge
SAR Search & Rescue
SUF Swedish Underwater Federation
SSAC Scottish Sub Aqua Club
SSI Scuba Schools International
STA Scuba Trade Association
SUSL Finnish Sportdivers Association
SWA Sheltered Water Assessment
SWP Safe Working Pressure
SWMBO She Who Must Be Obeyed
TBT Total Bottom Time
TD Technical Diver
TDI Technical Diving International
TIDF The Israeli Diving Federation
TLA Three Letter Acronym
TO Training Officer
TP Test Pressure
TPR Transportable Pressure Receptacle
TSM Technical Support Manager
TTS time to surface
TSV Tauchsportverband Oesterreichs (Austrian Diving Federation)
UDT Underwater Demolition Team
UHMS Undersea and Hyperbaric Medical Society
UPTD Unit Pulmonary Toxic Dose
UBA Underwater Breathing Apparatus
V Visual (Inspection of air cylinder for test purposes)
VDST Verband deutscher Sporttaucher e.V. (German Sport Diving Club)?
VDTL Verband deutscher Tauchlehrer e.V. (German Dive Instructor Agency)?
VPM Varying Permeability model
VVDS Variable Volume Drysuit
WASI World Association of Scuba Instructors?
WB Weightbelt
WP Water Pressure also Working Pressure
WKPP Woodville Karst Plains Project?
YBOD Yellow Box Of Death (a rather cruel and unfair reference to the Inspiration CCR)
YMCA Young Men's Christian Association


Hazel

MRSC = NO LONGER USED , but maybe found in non MCA publications..... ( all centers are MRCC's )