Ybod or Meg? Please help.

[Brass Monkey]

Some help and advice needed. I am very interested in training on and purchasing the YBOD but after reading about the Megladon I’m not so sure any more. Just about everyone on line who has the Ybod customises it, the Meg seems to be ready built for that kind of thing. Plus there’s the “batteries in the breathing loop” thing with the Ybod. I did think I had done my home work on this subject but now I’m all screwed up again. Will it be a case of VHS and Betamax. The Beta was better but availability of software put the VHS in front and we all know what happened to the Beta. Is the Meg thought to be a better unit. Issues with availability/training and after sales back up would put the Ybod in the lead. When making this kind of investment I want to know I getting the best I can for my money.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

[wreckweasel]

You kinda need to decide for yourself, based on;

- what kind of diving you want to do
- How much support you need
- your own spares policy
- your own belief in the manufacturers ethos and how likely they are to be around.
- Budget (dont forget import duties)

The primary decision, I'd suggest is about the first point and should lead you into a lot of thought on failure modes.

That wasnt a direct answer and deliberately so......... I know which I'd choose but my drivers are likely to be very different from yours.

Both are nicely made bits of kit, with their foibles evident (what is with that ADV on the meg!?).

PS. There was a good basic comparison in the last IANTD mag of all the mainstream breathers.

/Zak

[Brass Monkey]

Originally Posted by zaksherlock

You kinda need to decide for yourself, based on;

- what kind of diving you want to do

Deep wreck, Trimix. Obviously this is a want to do, the first year or so will be shallow in accordance with all the advice posted hear and by the training agency’s.

Originally Posted by zaksherlock

How much support you need
- your own spares policy

No one wants to fork out four to five grand then not be able to use the thing on account of needing an O ring or something simple.

Originally Posted by zaksherlock

- your own belief in the manufacturers ethos and how likely they are to be around.
/Zak

AP are not going to Disappear, not with a 10 week pre order time on units. As for the other crowd?

Well Zak it looks like you have done the Shrink thing and got me to face my own fears. Although the Megs nice when your clinical about it it’s just not that practical compared to the Ybod, and there's the element of risk due to limited back up.

Tw@t that I am I could have thought it out that way myself, dohhh.

I would like to read that article though, is it available on line or do you have to subscribe for hard copy?

Still a bit concerned about the batteries in the breathing loop. This could be just the yanks doing a biased test because the units not made in good old USA. Their good at that, if it’s not made state side it sucks. Unless of course we are talking about Porche's or Ferrari's or other exotic cars.

Thanks Zak.


Dave.

[wreckweasel]

Just to throw petrol on the fire.... everyones definition of "deep" varies.

If you want really deep, the meg has some veeeery interesting features;

- Radial scrubber
- Integrated deco computer (although Im not sure thats still the case since the late Mr Smithers passed away)
- highly failure tolerant (christ, you can even chop off the handsets underwater!)
- Its bullet proof, almost literally.

If you want a better view, why not contact Chris Hutchinson and see if he'll walk you through his lump.

On the down side, you have limited UK support (although thats not always an issue, see the widespread use of the KISS) and for me, those clips that hold the scrubber can to the lid are... worrying.

On the YBOD side, you can pickup units for £2 - £2.5k second hand... thats not a mega commitment if you're still feeling your way through things.

As for the "battery" issue. I think everyone agrees that batteries off gassing carcinogens into the loop is a bad thing. However the USN parameters were based around massively long exposure to the loop. So.. who knows. All I'll say is, have you walked through london recently, you probably hit more carcinogens then.

The worrying bit is that AP have alledgedly had the test results back for the lump and are refusing to release that test data to market. This is a bit in contrast to other manufacturers, ie Gordon Issued a warning to all users when a minor problem was find with a KISS part, then gave out free replacements to all users (the orifice spring on the original injector).


/Zak "freud"

[NotDeadYet]

Have a check that the Meg is still in production, I heard a rumour recently about very long delivery dates.

[Brass Monkey]

You have a good right to grin Zak, first you get me thinking about all the benefits of the Inspiration then you tell me all this good stuff about the Meg!
100m would be well deep enough for me, I think. The Inspiration is good for that so it’s still just in front. I’ve sent e mail off to the makers of the Meg to get an idea if they are still in production, pricing, training etc. It’s just a feeler though I’m pretty sure the Inspiration is the one for me. I don’t know but I would probably have to go to the states for training? Anyway I’ll see what comes back, if they give me any news that might be of interest to the board I’ll post it.

[wreckweasel]

If its any consolation, it took me two years to make my choice... after a LOT of research.

PS. theres at least two new breathers being launched at DEMA....

[Brass Monkey]

Originally Posted by zaksherlock

If its any consolation, it took me two years to make my choice... after a LOT of research.

PS. theres at least two new breathers being launched at DEMA....

It's already been two years, I thought I had things sorted until I took a long hard look at the Meg. I'd not even considered it before and then DR Zak got me on the couch. Now I'm ready for the raffia and basket weaving courses. Never mind CCR. Another two you say, the pian. What do you recomend Valium or Prozac?
And I thought facing the wife after dropping that kind of cash was going to be the hardest part.

[Skeletor]

As for the "battery" issue. I think everyone agrees that batteries off gassing carcinogens into the loop is a bad thing. However the USN parameters were based around massively long exposure to the loop. So.. who knows. All I'll say is, have you walked through london recently, you probably hit more carcinogens then.

The worrying bit is that AP have alledgedly had the test results back for the lump and are refusing to release that test data to market. This is a bit in contrast to other manufacturers, ie Gordon Issued a warning to all users when a minor problem was find with a KISS part, then gave out free replacements to all users (the orifice spring on the original injector).

Can someone please be kind enough to fill me in on what this is about?

Thanks,

John

[wreckweasel]

Originally Posted by John Hart

Can someone please be kind enough to fill me in on what this is about?

Thanks,

John

Its a long story, basically there have been instances of people flooding the loop which have generated small scale explosions from the battery. This has then rambled off into a second debate about the batteries off-gassing Dimethoxyethhane during normal use (USN testing was the source of this one)

Counterpoints to this have been;

1. If you flood the loop enough to cause the explosion risk, you've got a whole world of pain (caustic cocktail) and are almost certainly on OC bailout, or trying to evolve gills in a hurry
2. The safe limits for exposure to Dimethoxyethhane are something that only the USN have tested and their exposure length is ENORMOUS.

So now its a debate about opinions, religious beliefs and whose got the biggest todger. Theres no doubt that DME isnt good for you, but how do you rate it against all your other risks. Just for info, 100% of terminal cancer patients have been found to have a HIGH concentration of Hydrogen dioxide.

Whats upsetting a lot of people is that AP (alledgedly) haven't seen fit to inform the user base of whats going on and have (alledgedly) with-held the test data from their users.

I honestly don't know the answer, nor frankly do I care on anything other than an academic basis. For the net diving nerds, this is like 5 blowjobs at once, especially if they own a prism

If you want to see the original USN data; http://www.greywolfinnovations.com/APValves_LiMgBat.pdf

Good luck