Drowning man

[milldog]

Here in Devon there is a major stink about how the police acted in a incident at Exeter quay, a man tried to swim the river got into trouble and drowned two passers by dived in and tried to recover him, (these were two chap not trained in water recovery or life saving) Unfortunately they failed and the man died.

Now the complaints part the two chaps who jumped in have made an official complaint about the officers (3 of them trained in life saving recovery) saying that they should have gone in sooner to save the guy. Now having pulled someone from the water (they thrash about quite allot and will kill you to save themselves) would you blame the officers for not going in or would you commend them for not making the situation worse by one of them downing as well?

one point to note is that no one bothered to use a life ring at the waters edge??

over to the lion pit

Graham

personally i would have gone in with the ring but hine sight is great, and every situation is different

[SoggyFox]

they maybe trained in life saving techniques but are they really around to save lives, don't we employ them to protect us from crime. I don't see the police as the be all and all of social services, crime fighting, life saving and anything else we could add on cos no one else does it.

bit of a grey area.

I would have had maximum respect for them if they'd at least tried to help but i wouldn't hang them for not.

[dry suit diver]

Originally Posted by milldog

Here in Devon there is a major stink about how the police acted in a incident at Exeter quay, a man tried to swim the river got into trouble and drowned two passers by dived in and tried to recover him, (these were two chap not trained in water recovery or life saving) Unfortunately they failed and the man died.

Now the complaints part the two chaps who jumped in have made an official complaint about the officers (3 of them trained in life saving recovery) saying that they should have gone in sooner to save the guy. Now having pulled someone from the water (they thrash about quite allot and will kill you to save themselves) would you blame the officers for not going in or would you commend them for not making the situation worse by one of them downing as well?

one point to note is that no one bothered to use a life ring at the waters edge??

over to the lion pit

Graham

personally i would have gone in the ring but hine sight is great, and every situation is different

and that would save him how



difficult one really and I would probably have jumped in to try and save, but if they have been trained then they will have been trained to asses the risks and if they deemed it too dangerous then they were correct.

first rule of 1st aid is don't turn 1 casualty into 2 etc

[milldog]

Originally Posted by dry suit diver

and that would save him how

It wouldnt but i could have played around on the ring

what i ment to say is i would have gone to help and taken the ring GIT!!

Graham

[Adrian Kelland]

This happened a few minutes walk from where I live, I know the area well. The pub the man was asked to leave is a favourite of mine. The river is about 40m wide at this point

Rule no 1 - don't put yourself at un-necessary risk.

The river can have quite a flow on it and the casualty would have continued to move downstream as he sunk. He could have then gone 2 ways;
1 towards the canal entrance (~350m downstream) and gone further depending if the gates were opened.
2 towards a weir (~550m downstream) where he may snag, if he had not snagged anywhere else first.

The river would have been cold with vis of about nil.

So anyone saying they would have gone in - where do you start?

IMO, the police were correct in trying to use a boat to get out into the river, I would have done the same, but there would not have been much they could do once he was under water. None of the reports I have heard/seen indicate if he struggled to stay on the surface.

Given the amount of debris that comes down the river, neither would I have gone in with diving kit on without appropriate training and surface cover.

Adrian

[paramedic paul]

This is a very tricky area as some have said. I can't speak for the Police but our protocols say we should request Fire Service back up (Mountain Rescue/ RNLI in some areas) then wait and watch?

We aren't trained as a service in any form of rescue and as such, the Ivory Towers say, we are not covered by insurance and it's against health and safety policy etc etc.

Having said that, although personally i've never been in the situation, I'd like to think that I would have a go if I thought it was safe to do so IE canal/ pond yes, raging weir no!

[SML]

Originally Posted by Adrian Kelland

Given the amount of debris that comes down the river, neither would I have gone in with diving kit on without appropriate training and surface cover

Given by someone with first hand experience of the river it looks like the Police were correct not to just jump in but still a bad outcome, from the BBC web page he may have been trying to escape the police ?.

It's difficult to judge just upon what is written in the press putting the police in a bad light without all the facts.

[Marky Mark]

Wouldn't part of their training cover panicking casualty and risk assessment? First rule of rescue is don't become a casualty yourself. I would hope cometh the moment cometh the man and all that, but I'm not sure how I would respond. What did the bobbys have to say?

MyM

[scuboo]

Originally Posted by dry suit diver

first rule of 1st aid is don't turn 1 casualty into 2 etc

This is the important point. This is probably why the people who were trained didn't do anything rash and are still alive while the people who weren't trained jumped in. Maybe they're lucky to be out alive as well!

I'm glad to hear there weren't more casualties than just the one!

I'm sure the people who were trained and didn't go in don't feel great about this either!

[nigelH]

I have to confess that walking along by a river is normal clothes at this time of year I'd think twice about jumping in to save anybody big enough to fight back.

In a drysuit with a mask and fins I could probably manage anybody but a rescue when you're barely buoyant and suddenly very cold is very risky.