Usual YD Rules - What’s Reasonable?

[Gary K]

Originally Posted by stevechesh

I won't be organising that many trips up front next year. I've got some offshore wrecks i want to visit (which you know about) which will initially be by invite only (i.e TOSSERS) , as they have the potential to be a bit special (i hope ), so hopefully the financial side of things won't be too bad....Is £700 for a boat and one dive a lot of money

with the cost of diesel, they'll be less and less offshore unless you're willing pay big money I think

Originally Posted by stevechesh

It's nigh on impossible to get people on deep offshore exploratory trips
, and they get even more dis-heartened when it turns out to be a pile of rubbish. I know of one trip, approx 45 miles offshore and 120 odd metres down last year. All the research was done as far as possible, but when the guys got down there, it turned out to be an old mulberry harbour! Well, you can understand the disappointment, but it doesn't take too many of those trips before the enthusiasm starts to drop off. . .

could've been worse, could've been a sub

[stevechesh]

Originally Posted by warmwaterdiver

with the cost of diesel, they'll be less and less offshore unless you're willing pay big money I think

i just got in to this exploration lark 15 years too late. . .

edit: i've just seen my user profile. I'll be bringing some soap so you can wash your mouth out with that type of language

[Janos]

Well if I organise a trip then I either get people to pay all the money up front, or to book directly with the skipper.

I can't be dealing with the stress of filling spaces when people drop out.

Janos

[stevechesh]

Originally Posted by Janos

Well if I organise a trip then I either get people to pay all the money up front, or to book directly with the skipper.

I can't be dealing with the stress of filling spaces when people drop out.

Janos

So how do you go about getting the skipper to cover the cost of the empty spaces then? Do you say something along the lines of " I want to dive XX wreck on this date xxxxxxx but i can only fill 4 spaces (or whatever), can you fill the rest, and how much will it cost me on an individual basis?

[Janos]

Originally Posted by stevechesh

So how do you go about getting the skipper to cover the cost of the empty spaces then? Do you say something along the lines of " I want to dive XX wreck on this date xxxxxxx but i can only fill 4 spaces (or whatever), can you fill the rest, and how much will it cost me on an individual basis?

It depends.

Often the skipper will go out with six or eight or whatever, especially mid-week. I normally check I can get around four before provisionally booking something, then chivvy people along to book on themselves.

But yes, if not enough people book on then the boat doesn't go out. But I think this is infinitely preferable to me being down several hundred quid, or worrying about being down several hundred quid.

The price is often independent of the number of people booking on. But I have been on trips where we've got one less than the minimum and so everyone has agreed to split the price of the missing space between them.

Janos

[Razza]

Originally Posted by warmwaterdiver

could've been worse, could've been a sub

PMSL

[Sparky750]

I think the big one is if you put your name down you pay or fill the space reply to requests for payment and don't just say you forgot. If too many behave like this people aren't going to organise trips or request payment up front after a bit of searching it does seem people aren't affected by being named and shamed

[Mark Davies]

There are loads of apparently sensible comments, such as "get full payment up front" but I wonder just how many trips these people have organised recently?

At one time on YD filling a trip was no problem, and you'd expect with an ever-increasing membership it would be getting easier - but it isn't. The problem is, with more people on the boards there are more trips being organised. I haven't counted just how many Scapa trips are being organised for this summer but I wouldn't be surprised if it was in double figures. When our trip was in danger of going belly-up it was a real struggle getting the numbers and I know if I'd insisted on full payment at the start we would never have got the people we needed. I gave everyone the opportunity to make regular payments over the months to ease the burden of paying it all in one go, but few took up the option.

Now, I'm hoping everything will be fine, but as it stands we've got two empty spaces and no real interest in them. At such short notice where are you going to find people able to take a week's holiday in the middle of summer? I'm reliant totally on trust that those two will pay their money if they can't fill their space, but it wouldn't be the first time that someone decided not to bother. Sure, we can shame people on the site so that they won't be welcome on future trips, but believe it or not, YD is not the centre of the diving world and some people will consider it no real loss when it comes to saving a few hundred quid!

I may be anticipating a problem that won't materialise, but it does not negate the fact that organising a dive trip generally means months of hassle - and it's got nothing to do with booking the boat, dealing with skippers, sorting accommodation or any of that. The hassle is all and always about getting the money in from people - which is rarely anything other than a bloody nightmare. Most people are excellent and pay their money as soon as they are asked, but every trip seems to have one or two who make it such hard work.

Yes, it would be great if you could say to people, "Money up front or you don't go" - and there have been examples (such as Jamesie's Farne's trip) where this has worked well - but I'm thinking those days are gone. Even with the autumn Mull trip that I'm organising this year - which has always been one of the most popular and oversubscribed trips on the regular YD calendar - we've been struggling to keep the spaces full.

Bottom line, over the years I have seen it getting harder and harder and I've never before had the hassle I've experienced this year - not even when organising liveaboard trips to the Red Sea, which have demanded a considerably higher financial commitment from those going. People pulling out of trips has become far too regular - and I suppose with money getting tighter as it is it's no real surprise that diving is the first thing to be sacrificed. But at who else's expense?