Petrol prices to increase tomorrow

[Bantam]

Originally Posted by chrisch

We are altering the climate - that is a scientific fact and accepted by anyone that understands the process. The argument is how we are affecting it and by how much.

Actually, it's a theory, much like Decompression, it's not 'Scientific Fact'.

Don't be pulled in by the 'Daily Mail' science...

Agreed, we're pumping out shedloads of CO2, however, in comparison to the amount released by natural events such as forest fires and volcanic eruptions, it pales into insignificance - by a huge factor. The planet runs at a steady state - it will adjust other things to compensate.

As it happens, if the north pole melts, and the gulf stream stops, you'll find most of northern europe will be in permafrost, vs being nice and sunny.

As I said - the issue isn't that we're producing too much CO2 with relation to atmosphere - it's that we're going to run out of the raw material that produces all this CO2 - such as coal, oil and gas (including LPG). Why do you think the USA invaded Iraq? The Weapons of Mass Destruction argument was just a 'convenient truth' as Alan Greenspan put it recently.

100% Biodiesel is actually very green - primarily because the CO2 balances itself out - in growing the Rapeseed and other Bio Fuels, it removes as much CO2 from the atmosphere as it generates when being burnt, but also it's renewable. The only negative is particulates, but it's a small issue.

On average, about 20% of the content of the Diesel you buy from the pumps at Supermarket Forecourts in the UK now is Biodiesel.

[CotoChris]

As I live on the border to spain where diesel is much cheaper (€1.00/litre vrsus €1.11 in PT) I cross over to fill up saving €6.00 per tank). I went to Gibraltar last week where it was some £0.55p /litre, that was nice.

I would be the first to buy a hybrid car or GPL but I can't think of any main dealer selling show room GPL's, then you are not allowed to use undergrounf car parks.

As for Global Warming I believe humans are changing the climate but at the moment there is a lot of scare mongering where as everything is blamed on climate change.

[Finless]

Originally Posted by chrisch

What a good thing. Petrol is far too cheap. I take it no one gives a fuck about the environment. More tax please...

Chris

Petrol is not too cheap or, to be more precise, I do not consider it to be too cheap. The pretro/chemical industry is a market driven supply and demand thing that also happens to keep the government in funds (along with the other money that is leeched from motorists).

FWIW, I remain unconvinced and very sceptical that mankind has contributed f/all (of significance) to the current global warming. At the moment "green" is the buzz word and interest or funding isn't given to anything unless it is global warming based? Windfarms, what a 'kin waste of money they are so far! They'd have done better to give every household a little roof top wind generator and .........

The Earth will be far better off without humans on it and, if some survive, at least they'll have room to spread their elbows.

Also, the more I think about all the bloody taxes that I don't want to pay because I don't want to be contributing to what this government is doing etc!

[MATTBIN]

There was avery good TV programme on the other night re Global Warming, putting the same philosophy as Bantam has stated, part of the reason it argued that he Govt is putting up prices and claiming it to be for the benefit of the environment is that it is much the easiest way of conserving what fuel we have left. The belief being that the population will agree to using less fuel (of whatever kind) if it thinks it's helping the environment, BUT tell them we have to ration fuel (or anything) and panic buying/greed etc take over. Who here remembers when there was salt 'shortage', actually there wasnt but as soon as one paper reported there was consumer driven hysteria created one, as demand far outsripped the normal buying demands. Many people stocked up with years worth of salt, can you imagine the results of the Govt (any Govt) saying "Actually we are getting a bit short of Oil chaps, but dont worry if we are all sensible we have years of the stuff left" (Northern Rock anyone??)
We dont have years of the stuff left though so we had all better get used to high prices, a shortage (soon) and coming to terms with the fact that we will not be running our cars around as much as we do at present, depending on who you believe that situation is not very far away, not when people work out that its cheaper to transport 4 people (and their dive kit?) X miles in a fuel burner than ask someone to give them a ride in a rickshaw (sp?).
Sorry to be gloomy but planet Earth is running out of our consumables and someone better do something, sooner rather than later or we face extinction and it wont be when the big shiney thing turns an angry red and eats us.

Matt

[NotDeadYet]

Originally Posted by Finless

Windfarms, what a 'kin waste of money they are so far! They'd have done better to give every household a little roof top wind generator and .........

I've just spent the last few weeks designing a couple of industrial buildings. One of the early suggestions was to include some wind generation. We costed it, 250-500k per turbine and the time it took for each unit to even pay for itself (never mind become profitable) exceeded the lifespan of the facility. That isn't even including the whopping amount of concrete required for the structure (a particularly non-green material), the energy involved in fabricationg tubular steel masts (again, not insubstantial), tarnsportation, etc. I used to think people who objected to windfarms were the worst nimbyists but now I'm on their side. They are a total waste of time, money and resources. Absolutely useless and an eyesore to boot.

Another thing we are involved with is the production of biodiesel. Another great example of how people will buy anything that you stick "bio" on the front of. Acres of tropical forest cleared in Indonesia, replanted with oil palms, transported by road to ports, shipped round the world to the UK and processed into diesel so we can all feel better about driving cars.

It won't be too far off that big grain farms and agri-businesses will become the oil-barons of the future. Arable land is going to become increasing valuable if vegetable oil becomes a viable fuel. I do hope that any farmers still in the game remember exactly how much HM government plc has shafted them over the last 10 years when it happens.

Right, back to my Telegraph

[Finless]

Originally Posted by MATTBIN

and it wont be when the big shiney thing turns an angry red and eats us.

Matt

I didn't know UKD8's did that?

[MATTBIN]

Originally Posted by Finless

I didn't know UKD8's did that?

Sorted your batteries then?
Matt

[Foggy]

Ok so the tax increased on fuel this week, by 2p per litre.

So why in my area has this resulted in an increase between 0 and 4p per litre at the pumps?

Cynical answers only please


Cheers, Paul

[MATTBIN]

Originally Posted by Foggy

Ok so the tax increased on fuel this week, by 2p per litre.

So why in my area has this resulted in an increase between 0 and 4p per litre at the pumps?

Cynical answers only please


Cheers, Paul

So it averages out at 2p?

Matt

[Bantam]

Originally Posted by Foggy

Ok so the tax increased on fuel this week, by 2p per litre.

So why in my area has this resulted in an increase between 0 and 4p per litre at the pumps?

Cynical answers only please


Cheers, Paul

I'd love to put a Cynical answer, however, the truth is even more hilarious.

Because you pay VAT on the Duty (yes, double taxed), plus the oil price per barrel has gone up.

If you work it out, on a pump price of 100p;

Duty is 48.35p
VAT on Duty is 8.46p

Fuel Cost is 36.76p
VAT on Fuel Cost is 6.43p

So;

Going to Oil Company - 36.76p
Going to Government - 63.24p

So just over 63% of the cost of your fuel is tax.....

So where is the money going? As far as I can see the Government are squandering it on hugely expensive IT projects such as the ID card which won't benefit anyone, instead of on things like repairing roads (which is what the duty is meant to go into), NHS, Police, Schools etc..

They worry why inflation is going sky high along with people loading up their credit cards?

Funny how the cost of fuel and the amount of debt in this country has a correlation? I would wager that if you were to do an analysis of what people spend on their credit cards, a huge chunk of the debt is down to paying for fuel.