Trimix dive 65m 30min

[Digger]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Bob Cooper @ Aug. 28 2003,22:53)]Can somebody help me with the "quote" thing!

[quote]

You have to click the quote box at the top right of the post you want to quote from. It then goes into the rely page, and you click "quote" in the middle of the page, and it then adds the bit you've selected into your post.

WHy exactly, I end up with QUOTE after every quote I put up, I have no idea, but I'm presuming it won't work if I change that. Others don't have the problem.

[Digger]

Sorry, I forgot to add my little bit on the rule of thirds. Diving independants, I know that a third of the gas in my puppies, and a total failure in one tank, and I can still get home. Now, to get my buddy home too is an interesting one, because I increasingly am giving up on having a buddy at all. Then again, most of us are on indies too, so the chance of a total arse up is fairly small, and if all else fails I can still breathe off a tank valve. Not comfortable, and not exactly easy or advisable, but it might come in useful one day. Not any day this week, tho. And yes, I take my rig off to do it, as I am not an owl.

[Andy Phillips]

Bob,

The reality on this is, if you want a dive that is worth doing you have to abandon the rule of thirds. I agree that a 65M dive on 12's is pushing it, but it can be done, you have to rely on you buddy and the fact that you have enough gas to get to the first stop. Loose you deco gas and you are in real trouble. I know that bad things can happen but one hopes and prays that by maintaining your kit to a decent standard will prevent most major issues.

This for me is the reality of deep diving in the UK. But having said this I have seen some amasing thigs and hope to see many more.

You are absolutly right, deco is a personal thing, but as was pointed out to me after we had done the Duke for the first time, if the dive is good enough then the deco just does not matter. I agree with this, bad dive deco sucks, good dive it just evaporates without noticing.

Mark has said that after the Ilinois he hit his deco limit, i.e. he could not bear any more. But, we are due to do the Blue Hole in Dahab in Egypt in Jan, this is at 93 ~ 100M, the deco will be longer. My hope isthat we will be occupied by the fantastic fish life around us.

Take care.

Andrew

[Mark]

<font color='#0000FF'>

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Bob Cooper @ Aug. 28 2003,22:53)]Can somebody help me with the &quot;quote&quot; thing!

Bob,

if you want to make multiple quotes in one reply you need to manually add the quotes. Place what you want to quote between two quote remarks (a start quote and an end quote). Like this.......

[ quote ]text to be quoted.....[ /quote ]

You don't need the spaces after/before the [ ] symbols. I had to add them otherwise my example would be read as code and quoted. Like this....

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]text to be quoted.....

HTH

Happy quoting

Mark.

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Bob Cooper @ Aug. 28 2003,22:51)]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]I can't get this bloody &quot;quote&quot; thing to work so I'll reply with your test in &quot;quotes&quot;:-)

If you click on the quote in the top right corner of the thread it will take you to your message pannel. Below that will another box with the message you wish to quote from.

You can deleat the bits you dont want and the rest will appear in a quote box above your message.

If you wish to do as i am doing here, and have multiple quote boxes, you can click quote at the top of your message board and Quote will apear on you message. Cut and paste the bit you want to quote after that and click quote again. The second quote will be &nbsp;\ quote. and this will end the box.

Having cut and paste all the required text into your message deleat the text in the Quote box below or it will all apear in your thread.

Hope this helps

Mark Chase

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Bob Cooper @ Aug. 28 2003,22:51)]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]Yes, I'm talking about thirds here. &nbsp;YOU may have surfaced with 80 bar or 90 bar or whatever, but consider the effect of a total loss of gas at your point of maximum penetration. &nbsp;Would you have sufficient gas to get you and your buddy to your first gas switch? &nbsp;True, this is a cave diving rule, but I don't see why it's different for an ocean dive. &nbsp;Sure, we cut things a bit fine but strictly speaking, cutting hr BT by 5 mins isn't that big a deal.

Bob

Whilst I understand your point the truth is that a dive without deep penitration into the wreck can not be compaired to a cave dive. Light entry only was performed on this dive in big space due to the solo nature of the dives and the depth.

If you looked at my dive plan you would also see I had a redundent 3ltr pony of air in case of total loss of back gas. This had to get me from the wreck and up to 42m for my first gas switch aproxamatly 20m . If my sac shot up to 20 due to stress I would have 4 1/2 minuits to get to stop depth.

On top of that I had 10 ltr travel gas of 32%. I only needed 100 bar for the dive so I had 150 in reserve. In a total cluster situation I would gas switch at a PP02 of 2 &nbsp;51m, clip my self to the deco station, borrow someones back gas for a 20min air break and go back on 02 using a knecklesed rig straped around my head. CNS for a 30 at 62 would be 347%

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]True, this is a cave diving rule, but I don't see why it's different for an ocean dive. &nbsp;Sure, we cut things a bit fine but strictly speaking, cutting hr BT by 5 mins isn't that big a deal

5mins no, but it would have cut my profile by 15

If you are 62m deep in a cave you may have no option to bail to the first stop depth as there can be a lot of rock between you and that depth. The same can be said of a deep wreck penitration but i would only do this as a buddy dive and with the thirds rule firmly in place

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]I wasn't there but speaking to them afterwards I think this was a &quot;peer pressure&quot; thing. &nbsp;We've all done it, myself included. &nbsp;The profile was a bit aggressive, but nothing I wouldn't do myself and they are much fitter than me!

Quite agree on the peer presure bit, me too
Mind I cant understand how two admitidly inexperaianced divers beleived they were so knoladgable about Deco theory that they could shave that much off of the shallow stops. They simpley did not have the background experiance with deco and their own personal tolerance to make those decisions.

I also cant understand the acceptance of the profile by the hyperbaric docter when it does not conform to even a very agresive RGBM model

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]Sorry, no chance! &nbsp;The VR3 won't teach them anything about deco. &nbsp;A bit like flying a plane. &nbsp;I could sit in a cockpit, turn on the autopilot and fly from here to Miami....It won't teach me anything about flying though!

Didnt think so

I wasent thinking auto pilot i was thinking more anti collision warning.

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]
It's not just a matter of making the profiles work using a dive planning prog. &nbsp;It's got more to do with adjusting the deco. to suit the individual. &nbsp;I am gradually getting to know what deco. I NEED to do. &nbsp;The trouble is the DECO that diver A &quot;needs&quot; may be more or less that the deco. diver B &quot;needs&quot; to do.

OK I am two stone over weight and 39, but I work out every day and play four hour of badminton every week. I started running 30-85 profiles when I got into long deco and I didnt get bent. Then I met Andyp who asked me to run 10-80 and 20 -85 profiles. I felt instantly better ie I had more energy after the dive and have run them ever since.

George Bartlett (another DIR wannaby) &amp; I talked to Izzy about deco and he too sang the praise of 20 - 80 profiles

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]This isn't a DIR thing. &nbsp;This thread is really interesting and you have some valuable input here. &nbsp;Don't take it as a &quot;DIR vs Stroke&quot; thing.

Not at all, your input is always valuable and your bias just adds another angle to the debate

ATB

Mark Chase

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]This exercise is being conducted to help understand deco I hope and not to criticise a persons dive report as that would be unfair considering your recent 'critique'. Finally, I have said before that I don't call anyone a st@@ke. Do unto others and all that.

I dont intend to have a go at them personaly but I have read a couple of I got bent but my profile was fine, comments in the past that on closer examination was found to be wrong.

This of concern because people read it and start thinking how dangerous this sport it. People like life insurance and mortguage brokers. I feel it is important to point out that what these lads did is outside accepted deco diving practice ie outside conventional tables.

The divers admited their errors on planning 20-100 profiles for two deep dives and all credit to them for that but they didnt point out that they were shaving stops off the origional 20-100 profile.

Your post was fine i understod it but paraphraised the result as it could have got lost in all the dater provided.

I ran it on Vplanner and it still didnt work even on bendamatic version 2

ATB

Mark Chase

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (wetlettuce @ Aug. 29 2003,11:31)]On Jplan I can get 58 minutes if I use GF's of 20 and 120.

I'm not saying its big and I'm not saying its clever but if you use those settings you can match it. (Is that Bendomatic mode?! )

MY GOD

Deco planner dosent even let you set over 100% obviously because 100% is considered maximum off gassing limit.

Yep definatly bendomatic

ATB

Mark Chase