Deco stage set up

[chrisch]

Originally Posted by Janos

Re: The BSAC courses,

With the introduction of the trimix courses both BSAC extended range and Advanced Nitrox are under review.

I think the old Advanced Nitrox was a great course in it's time. Remember that BSAC introduces small amounts of deco much earlier than other agencies. However it was never meant to be a 'techie' course and instructors were actively encouraged NOT to teach in twinsets.

.....

I'm looking forward to the update. I think the sport mixed gas courses are fantastic. The syllabus is excellent and if taught properly the course would rival the "big two" There's damn near a DIR-F (sorry GUE-F now isn't it) in there if you look hard.

BSAC's adv EAN is badly out of date and the name confuses many people who think its an accelerated deco course (since the other agencies offering are just that). (Hey we're nearly back on thread) I really really hope that Beeserk do something like they have done with the mix courses with the AdvEAN/ERD If so this will inevitably filter back (albeit slowly) into the DL training.

With everyone finishing their SD with a nitrox ticket there's no place any more for the well worn advice to do the "combined" EAN course as "you might as well do both at the same time". There's no place therefore for the old AdvEAN course.

Dinosaurs prepare to meet thy doom. Yeah - way to go beardie folk !!

Chris

[Janos]

Originally Posted by Mal Bridgeman

[color="DarkRed"]I was providing an illustration of my point.... as I say, if you want chapter and verse, look back at the incident reports, then make your own mind up about it.

Looking back through the incident reports is a great way to learn from isolated, individual mistakes. The thing I take from the incident you mentioned is to always check your valves are on before you get into the water. But this applies equally to twinsets as side-slung ponies as back-mounted ponies.

It does not tell you which way is safer because there is no information about the number of dives done with a particular configuration or system.

Using your logic I could argue that all diving should be done in October to February as "every fatality that occured in 2007 happened between March and September"

Janos

[Mal Bridgeman]

Originally Posted by Janos

Using your logic I could argue that all diving should be done in October to February as "every fatality that occured in 2007 happened between March and September"

That's not my logic, though. As you yourself have pointed out there is no denominator data. I would suggest one does not need to mathematically / statistically prove some things to know they are not a good idea.

Originally Posted by Janos

Looking back through the incident reports is a great way to learn from isolated, individual mistakes. The thing I take from the incident you mentioned is to always check your valves are on before you get into the water. But this applies equally to twinsets as side-slung ponies as back-mounted ponies.

My conclusion is different ... you need to train into people, that maintaining a constant knowledge of the gas they have remaining is vital, you make things simple for the new diver by only giving them one source to monitor and you are relentess about OOG procedures so if they screw up then it's an inconvenience.

Mal

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by videogirl

I am currently doing a Nitrox Decompression course and am looking at possible stage set ups for my deco gas. I currently dive with a single cylinder (12l) and a pony. I potentially may switch to a twin set at some point in the next year or so.

What would people recommend as a stage set up for deco? Does anyone use a 3l deco cylinder attached with a clamp on the other side of the cylinder (2 pony set up?)

Back mounted deco gas has killed a fair number of divers. Don't do it under any circumstances.


Rig your 3ltr and side sling it like a proper deco stage. I dived my pony like this and used as a deco stage before purchasing two 7s.


ATB

Mark

[Janos]

Originally Posted by Mal Bridgeman

That's not my logic, though. As you yourself have pointed out there is no denominator data. I would suggest one does not need to mathematically / statistically prove some things to know they are not a good idea.

Ah. Your basing your judgement on "gut instinct." Nice. Only problem is that when someone disagrees with you, you have nothing to base your arguments on.

Originally Posted by Mal Bridgeman

My conclusion is different ... you need to train into people, that maintaining a constant knowledge of the gas they have remaining is vital, you make things simple for the new diver by only giving them one source to monitor and you are relentess about OOG procedures so if they screw up then it's an inconvenience.

Good point about the OOG procedures. However, I'm not sure where "new diver" comes from.

But you originally said:

Originally Posted by Mal

Unfortunately, too many people are getting hurt, diving systems/configs/procedures they have designed/developed themselves.

And I still haven't seen anything to back this statement up. You seem to have pulled it from thin air.

Janos

[GLOC]

'Tis nearly Friday

[warmwaterdiver]

Originally Posted by GLOC

'Tis nearly Friday

well its the last working day of the week for most of us

[Mal Bridgeman]

Originally Posted by Janos

And I still haven't seen anything to back this statement up. You seem to have pulled it from thin air.

Janos

One instance is too many in my book .... but the BSAC incident reports contain many others ... about 15 per year, AFAICR. If you think I am pulling this from thin air there is no point in discussing it further.

Read the reports, draw your own conclusion then come back with your recommendations. I would be keen to read them.
Mal

[chrisch]

Originally Posted by warmwaterdiver

well its the last working day of the week for most of us

Speak for yourself I aint doin' no work.

[Bardo]

What's the difference between having a discussion like this on YD and pissing in the wind? Not a lot, if you ask me...