'The Illinois' - A Stroke's Tale

[Lou]

Mark,

That makes me twitch just reading it.  Excellent report though.  I think that a few of those who have commented need to step back a moment and think about what they would have done.  Especially thoughtprovoking for me was your situation of removing the last strobe to then see diver's bubbles?  Would the detractors have ignored the bubbles or risked blowing even their plus 5 plan to see if there was a problem?  

It would be interesting to see how others would feel they would have coped with that situation, bearing in mind they are in the fortunate position of being able to consider at length from their keyboard.

Having said all that, after alot of planning from you I can tell that it didn't go the way that you might have expected and i hope the "team" learns from the experience and it is smooth as you like next time!

Cheers

Lou

[And]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Lou @ Aug. 26 2003,13:21)]I think that a few of those who have commented need to step back a moment and think about what they would have done.  Especially thoughtprovoking for me was your situation of removing the last strobe to then see diver's bubbles?  Would the detractors have ignored the bubbles or risked blowing even their plus 5 plan to see if there was a problem?  

It would be interesting to see how others would feel they would have coped with that situation, bearing in mind they are in the fortunate position of being able to consider at length from their keyboard.

<font color='#0000FF'>Hi

I don't think anyone was criticising Mark in particular, I know I wasn't. The last strobe and still seeing bubbles issue comes partly from the fact that Mark was diving solo and that there were solo divers on the dive.

If Mark had a buddy then things may have been different. He wouldn't have had to make the decision alone. If the solo diver had a buddy things may have been different. He may have remembered to add a strobe. If the solo diver had a buddy and then followed the procedure and fixed a strobe it may have been different. The buddy pairs are helping each other.

Not only that but the other diver then left the last strobe that Mark left and then started worrying about it later. He obviously felt that the rules didn't apply to him. This caused unneccessary confusion. None of which was Marks fault, other than he made the decision to leave his buddy, again because his buddy changed the plan, not Mark.

Mark had his plan, and it was changed for him. I really don't know what I would have done in his situation apart from the fact that I wouldn't have dived with a buddy I hadn't dived with before and who was on a different plan to me. I do say that from the comfort of my keyboard having not spent £120 on gas and £x for the trip and holidays off work. I believe thats were the potential incident pit started, not at the last strobe point. I really am not a detractor Lou, and like I said, was not criticising Mark at all. (Although I'm sure you thought I would )

Kindest Regards

Andy

[Lou]

Andy, I wasn't meaning you, and although a name or two springs to mind who I would include I also meant those who would sit and judge whilst reading it.

I agree that a buddy for both divers may have helped *prevent* that instance, but not necessarily. &nbsp;I just used that example as a specific point for discussion as it is potentially quite emotive. &nbsp;Given all the circumstances would you have broken your plan to go and see if the bubbles came from a diver in distress? &nbsp;I buddy wouldn't necessarily help you make that decision as I would guess it comes from within you and you are unlikely to be swyed by any hand waving or scribbled notes to the contrary. &nbsp;However I've never been in anything like that sitaution so I am only guessing!

I too wouldn't have dived with a buddy I had never dived with before, but I guess in a team type dive you are trusting that it isn't some geezer off the street and that everyone has been invited along and is well known to someone, so the situation is different again to anything I have experienced.

Mark has been the first to admit that it all went tits up, he didn't have to write the post, and he was more honest than he needed to be, without excuses, which I think is great. &nbsp;I do think that more is to be gained from thinking it all through and discussing it than from just dismissing it as a literal example of the title.

I was wondering where Mark's &quot;tail&quot; was going to come into it all though..... , sounded almost pornographic!

Dive safe

Lou

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (wetlettuce @ Aug. 26 2003,16:27)]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]
If Mark had a buddy then things may have been different. He wouldn't have had to make the decision alone. If the solo diver had a buddy things may have been different. He may have remembered to add a strobe. If the solo diver had a buddy and then followed the procedure and fixed a strobe it may have been different. The buddy pairs are helping each other.

Not only that but the other diver then left the last strobe that Mark left and then started worrying about it later. He obviously felt that the rules didn't apply to him. This caused unneccessary confusion. None of which was Marks fault, other than he made the decision to leave his buddy, again because his buddy changed the plan, not Mark.

To be honist I think you have all been very generous. I was expecting far more criticisum than I have received.

Thanks all

Mark Chase

[Diving Dude]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Mark Chase @ Aug. 27 2003,00:32)]To be honist I think you have all been very generous. I was expecting far more criticisum than I have received.

You're a useless ugly git that drives a crap car!

Does that make you feel better Mark.

[Mdemon]

Now THAT'S technical diving! Fantastic read Mark.

I've found myself doing more solo stuff in the same vein - solo but with others doing the same dive. &nbsp;The feeling of freedom, and the reduction in task loading is excellent and makes it feel like an intirely different sort of dive.

Cheers Mate!

[Pierre Farrugia]

<font color='#0000FF'>Hello,

This is what I think, when doing this type of dives, I will do them with my Buddy. For me diving solo is not an option and in my diving rules is a compromise of safety. I think being in two (that means being a good buddy pair, not just a diver diving solo beside you which will cause you more trouble than help). As I always say these are only up to each single diver and what you feel is good or not. Everyone has things which he consider is tolerable and others not.

So at the end it's all up to diver preference. But as said before it's up to the single diver needs, and better to never say no, on a technical dive you are always equipped for solo!

Pierre

[Lanny]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (diving dude @ Aug. 27 2003,00:38)]You're a useless ugly git that drives a crap car!

You are not a proper diver unless the kit in your car is worth at least 5 times as much as the car itself. &nbsp;I could buy my car plus 2 back-ups (as per the best tech diving practices) for the cost of my primary light!

You know you have got it really bad when you plan your next car on the basis of how many stages you can fit in it and when you start calling all string cave line.

[Mark Chase]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Lanny @ Aug. 27 2003,14:24)]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (diving dude @ Aug. 27 2003,00:38)]You're a useless ugly git that drives a crap car!

Yeah True M8 but at least I dont have to wear THAT dry suit

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]You know you have got it really bad when you plan your next car on the basis of how many stages you can fit in it and when you start calling all string cave line.

My M8 Pete and his wife Lesley have just baught a pick up truck one of the Mitsubushy Worrier things. Reasion why? they couldent fit their 6 twin sets 10 stages and CD Scooter in their Ford Focus

I kid you not

ATB

Mark Chase

[Phil Ennis]

<font color='#0000FF'>Car? &nbsp; Get a van, you can even sleep in it. &nbsp;