View Full Version : configuration question



davydiver
25-11-09, 08:35 AM
Having quit rebreather diving i'm now back on twins and am looking at some of the DIR ways of configuring my kit, I have set up my hoses and regs thus.

Right post, main reg on long hose, wing feed
Left post backup reg on standard hose, suit feed, gauge

I usually use a 5ltr stage cyl aswell, why is the gauge clipped onto the left waist d-ring instead of the right as the stage cyl is clipped onto the left and could obstruct the access to the gauge.

Paul Burgess
25-11-09, 09:02 AM
why is the gauge clipped onto the left waist d-ring instead of the right as the stage cyl is clipped onto the left and could obstruct the access to the gauge.

There are a few reasons that I can think over. There are probably more.

1/ It may trap the long hose on the right post
2/ It lets you know if you have left your manifold closed (if the needle doesn't move)
3/ Scootering, your right hand is occupied

GLOC
25-11-09, 09:08 AM
Practice :)

Access to the SPG isn't that much of an issue, even when diving with 2 stages up front and another clipped on the leash (so 3 bolt snaps, plus the SPG on the D-ring), and I can still get hold of the SPG.

It really isn't an issue.

Regards

RichW
25-11-09, 10:00 AM
Hi Davy,

I see you're up in Huddersfield. Not far from me. If you want to meet up and go through a few configuration bits and pieces, I'd be happy to oblige.

Rich

Fart Mersho
25-11-09, 10:02 AM
Off topic, but can I ask why you're moving away from CCR? I'm only interest as that's my end goal.

Digger
25-11-09, 10:04 AM
Off topic, but can I ask why you're moving away from CCR? I'm only interest as that's my end goal.

Probably same reason as the rest of us - Because on OC it's easier to look cool :D

Digs.

davydiver
25-11-09, 10:27 AM
Hi Davy,

I see you're up in Huddersfield. Not far from me. If you want to meet up and go through a few configuration bits and pieces, I'd be happy to oblige.

Rich


Thanks very much for the offer Rich, that would be great sometime, however i'm not wanting to go fully DIR purely down to cost, the kit ive got is the kit i'm going to use and some of it isnt DIR but I do like some of the philosophy and mindset of DIR diving.

Dave

davydiver
25-11-09, 10:41 AM
Off topic, but can I ask why you're moving away from CCR? I'm only interest as that's my end goal.

Well apart from Diggers response!

I used to dive twins and got into deeper diving so decided to go down the ccr route, then along came my son and I no longer get enough time and money to justify keeping the rebreather, in addition to that having a little one made me a bit more sensible with my diving no more buggering off down to 70m with trimix in the unit! without being qualified for it!
So I sold the unit and its gone on a long holiday to Australia pity I couldnt have hand delivered it!
If I could offer a few words of wisdom about CCR diving, think long and hard about why you want to go CCR, it is fantastic but its very hard work, you can do a lot of diving on OC without the hassel of cells causing problems, sofonolime issues, leaking bits, etc etc

I'm really enjoying being back on open circuit, I did a dive a while back with my CCR buddies, 47m dive and I only had 3 more minutes deco than them, I was using air and 60% deco gas. and I was able to wriggle into tighter spaces than them! :-D

Fart Mersho
25-11-09, 10:47 AM
Well apart from Diggers response!

I used to dive twins and got into deeper diving so decided to go down the ccr route, then along came my son and I no longer get enough time and money to justify keeping the rebreather, in addition to that having a little one made me a bit more sensible with my diving no more buggering off down to 70m with trimix in the unit! without being qualified for it!
So I sold the unit and its gone on a long holiday to Australia pity I couldnt have hand delivered it!
If I could offer a few words of wisdom about CCR diving, think long and hard about why you want to go CCR, it is fantastic but its very hard work, you can do a lot of diving on OC without the hassel of cells causing problems, sofonolime issues, leaking bits, etc etc

I'm really enjoying being back on open circuit, I did a dive a while back with my CCR buddies, 47m dive and I only had 3 more minutes deco than them, I was using air and 60% deco gas. and I was able to wriggle into tighter spaces than them! :-D

Thanks for that, it will be useful advice I think. I am/was thinking that ccr must be the way forward as it's the only way to go deeper than 45-50m without having to pay a fortune for trimix fills.

I'm not sure if I need/want to be doing 80m dives with an hour of deco or anything, but I would like to be on trimix at 50m so I'm not narked off my tree. As I understand it, average fills on nitrox in twin 12's will be 80 at least.

davydiver
25-11-09, 10:57 AM
Thanks for that, it will be useful advice I think. I am/was thinking that ccr must be the way forward as it's the only way to go deeper than 45-50m without having to pay a fortune for trimix fills.

I'm not sure if I need/want to be doing 80m dives with an hour of deco or anything, but I would like to be on trimix at 50m so I'm not narked off my tree. As I understand it, average fills on nitrox in twin 12's will be 80 at least.

If your regularly diving to 50m then CCR may be the way to go, but you could probably do it on open circuit air if you build up to it, I used to regularly dive in the 40-50m range on air, admitadly Its better / safer on a mix but i'm a tight yorkshireman and air is free!
If cost isnt an issue and you can put up with the hassel of CCR then great but to be diving to those depths sensibly your looking at 500 for MOD1 then another 500 for MOD3 thats asuming you are already tech nitrox qualified or similar, then a good 6 months to a year getting experience shallower.

NotDeadYet
25-11-09, 11:20 AM
I usually use a 5ltr stage cyl aswell, why is the gauge clipped onto the left waist d-ring instead of the right as the stage cyl is clipped onto the left and could obstruct the access to the gauge.

I sometimes leave my SPG unclipped while I'm getting my stages on then pull it into place afterwards and clip it on so that it is sitting in the top most position on the d-ring and stays accessible.

RichW
25-11-09, 12:00 PM
Thanks very much for the offer Rich, that would be great sometime, however i'm not wanting to go fully DIR purely down to cost, the kit ive got is the kit i'm going to use and some of it isnt DIR but I do like some of the philosophy and mindset of DIR diving.

Dave

The offer wasn't contingent on you joining up mate ;)

I do this kind of thing quite a lot. To look at where somebody is now, and give them some advice on how to move forward to where they want to be. In the fastest/most cost effective way possible.

Rich

stephensoncj
02-12-09, 10:36 PM
Davy

I sit on the balcony every Monday watching the Octopush - been diving a DIR rig for several years and have done all the moves you have, twins to eCCR and back to twins. the SPG on the left is no issue,you have all the other hoses in the right place, have a look on the web there are lots of hose routing pictures available Evolve wing using DS4 stages - hose routing pics - DIR Explorers (http://www.direxplorers.com/dir-kit-set-up-fundamentals/1443-evolve-wing-using-ds4-stages-hose-routing-pics.html) which has a few good pictures and alternatives.

happy to chat on a Monday if you like - usually have a ipod stuffed in my ears watching my daughter bat a puck around


chris

Diving Dude
03-12-09, 12:16 AM
The short spg hose on the left d ring is no issue untill you run out of gas because it's too hard for you check.


Oops l forgot, in this part of the forum everyone keeps quiet about fook ups.

neilh
03-12-09, 10:15 AM
why is the gauge clipped onto the left waist d-ring instead of the right as the stage cyl is clipped onto the left and could obstruct the access to the gauge.

There'll be a few of us at Capernwray on the 13th - happy to have a chat if you're there too.


The short spg hose on the left d ring is no issue untill you run out of gas because it's too hard for you check.

Oops l forgot, in this part of the forum everyone keeps quiet about fook ups.

:confused:
If you can't check your SPG then you're not doing anything right - DIR or otherwise. Clipping it to your left d-ring doesn't prevent you getting to it as many of us (including plenty hogarthian divers who aren't fully signed-up DIR followers) can testify to.

Woz
03-12-09, 10:19 AM
What I do is put the SPG on a long HP hose then run it under your left arm, across your chest and clip it off on your right D ring. Then all you have to do is look down to see how much gas you have. And even your buddy can see what you have. I'ts brilliant and I bet someone copies it :(

Mal Bridgeman
03-12-09, 10:22 AM
The short spg hose on the left d ring is no issue untill you run out of gas because it's too hard for you check.


Oops l forgot, in this part of the forum everyone keeps quiet about fook ups.

Do you know of an incident involving a DIR trained diver that happened to, Howard?

I share your concern that people don't nail that skill properly early enough, especially if they "copy" the config or, as they like to say, "cherry pick the good bits".

but in GUE training it's reinforced in the Fundamentals class and for cave and tech, if you have not mastered that you would be found out pretty quickly.

It's a knack thing that once sorted is sorted ... like riding a bike. I recall my buddy's first dive in DIR config when he struggled like anything with it......but after a few repetitions he figured it out.
Mal

Bottle Maker
03-12-09, 10:34 AM
Do you know of an incident involving a DIR trained diver that happened to, Howard?

I share your concern that people don't nail that skill properly early enough, especially if they "copy" the config or, as they like to say, "cherry pick the good bits".

but in GUE training it's reinforced in the Fundamentals class and for cave and tech, if you have not mastered that you would be found out pretty quickly.

It's a knack thing that once sorted is sorted ... like riding a bike. I recall my buddy's first dive in DIR config when he struggled like anything with it......but after a few repetitions he figured it out.
Mal

I do not know of any incidents form configuring your kit that way but having watched somebody try to unclip there SMG then give up as the stage was getting in the way, I thought at the time that is unnecessary complication easily solved by having there contents gauge come under there are and clip to the chest D ring.

Graham.

1693
03-12-09, 10:40 AM
I do not know of any incidents form configuring your kit that way but having watched somebody try to unclip there SMG then give up as the stage was getting in the way, I thought at the time that is unnecessary complication easily solved by having there contents gauge come under there are and clip to the chest D ring.Some things do take some mastering and this is one of them.

If you start-off doing it this way, you ought to have it cracked by the time you add a deco bottle and have it really nailed by the time you're adding a second.

If we never stuck at things in order to master them we'd all be riding around with stabilisers, just 'cos it's easier than making the effort.

Mal Bridgeman
03-12-09, 10:47 AM
I do not know of any incidents form configuring your kit that way but having watched somebody try to unclip there SMG then give up as the stage was getting in the way, I thought at the time that is unnecessary complication easily solved by having there contents gauge come under there are and clip to the chest D ring.

Graham.

I wonder how well he had nailed the skill before he added the stage into the equation .... a stage really shouldn't be a problem .... it either hangs below or you push it out of the way.

It really is not that hard - but the really important point is that you need to be able to check gas regardless of config - there are a number of configs to enable you to do that - the DIR config is clipped to the left hip d-ring.

Mal

Naomi S
03-12-09, 11:15 AM
I wonder how well he had nailed the skill before he added the stage into the equation .... a stage really shouldn't be a problem .... it either hangs below or you push it out of the way.

It really is not that hard - but the really important point is that you need to be able to check gas regardless of config - there are a number of configs to enable you to do that - the DIR config is clipped to the left hip d-ring.

Mal

Going to disagree a bit here about the stage. This time last year I first tried the DIR config and needless to say I struggled with upclipping the spg along with dumping gas from the wing. Everyone does. Bit of practice and by the end of the DIRx weekend I had it nailed.

I have just started carrying a stage and have found that it does get in the way a bit and am now back to struggling a bit (not alot but enough to be annoying) with the spg and with finding my wing inflate which is sometimes not where it was cos of the stage and I have to find it. Bit more practice and I will have this nailed too but it does get in the way when you first add a stage and needs practice again regardless of the fact I had got all this nailed before adding a stage.

1693
03-12-09, 11:47 AM
not alot but enough to be annoyingYou're not that annoying ;)


....with the spg and with finding my wing inflate which is sometimes not where it was cos of the stage and I have to find it. Bit more practice and I will have this nailed too but it does get in the way when you first add a stage and needs practice again regardless of the fact I had got all this nailed before adding a stage.Try using some sensible gloves instead of those massive Smurf things you've got (or are those your hands?)

davydiver
03-12-09, 11:50 AM
Thanks for all the replies guys and gals, bit of an update for you, this weekend just gone i was diving the clyde, not exactly a good environment to try new kit and configurations, but I like a challenge, so I went for the one piece harness and DIR config for hoses the first dive was a bit of a struggle clipping the SPG back onto the d-ring but after a while it was fine, the harness was ok too allthough I got soaked on the last dive, as I wriggled into my kit it pulled my suit down a bit, that combined with a slack neckseal and a current in the first 3m meant I got a big slosh of water down my back on the way down, lovely!

I loved diving the rig as I had it configured really comfy and free from clutter, just had to put up with the piss taking from some of the other divers but I'm thick skinned!

Naomi S
03-12-09, 11:51 AM
You're not that annoying ;)

Oh I am :)


Try using some sensible gloves instead of those massive Smurf things you've got (or are those your hands?)

Yeah they were the large lined showas. Ridiculous gloves. Not sure what seaskin were thinking sending me them. I use small unlined ones now and have better dexterity than I do in wet gloves. :p

davydiver
03-12-09, 11:53 AM
I use silly big smurf gloves too and never had a problem with them, even manage to operate a video camera with them, keep my hands nice and warm

RichW
03-12-09, 12:00 PM
Thanks for all the replies guys and gals, bit of an update for you, this weekend just gone i was diving the clyde, not exactly a good environment to try new kit and configurations, but I like a challenge, so I went for the one piece harness and DIR config for hoses the first dive was a bit of a struggle clipping the SPG back onto the d-ring but after a while it was fine, the harness was ok too allthough I got soaked on the last dive, as I wriggled into my kit it pulled my suit down a bit, that combined with a slack neckseal and a current in the first 3m meant I got a big slosh of water down my back on the way down, lovely!

I loved diving the rig as I had it configured really comfy and free from clutter, just had to put up with the piss taking from some of the other divers but I'm thick skinned!

Hi Davy,

Glad you got on well with the harness. If you have to struggle to get in and out of it, then two things are possible.

1. It's set a little tight, or
2. Technique needs a little polish ;-)

Its not clear if you were diving from a RIB or a hardboat, but either way, when you get into the harness, make sure the wing is fully defalted. This will give you more room. Then put one arm through a strap (I like to do the left first and hook up the drysuit as I go in). Now try and get your shoulders lower than the top of the plate (easier on a hardboat than a RIB) and slip your other arm in. Take the weight of the system and let it settle. The crotch strap and waist straps can now be found and attached.

If this is still a struggle, then you may have the shoulder straps a little tight.

Hope that helps!

Rich

PS Don't worry about the stick from other divers. They're just jealous ;)

davydiver
03-12-09, 12:03 PM
Cheers Rich

We were on Clutha (hardboat) and I meant clipping the spg back on was a bit of a struggle the 1st few times, getting in and out of the harness was ok really i'm glad I'd read up about it first.

Dave

Hi Davy,

Glad you got on well with the harness. If you have to struggle to get in and out of it, then two things are possible.

1. It's set a little tight, or
2. Technique needs a little polish ;-)

Its not clear if you were diving from a RIB or a hardboat, but either way, when you get into the harness, make sure the wing is fully defalted. This will give you more room. Then put one arm through a strap (I like to do the left first and hook up the drysuit as I go in). Now try and get your shoulders lower than the top of the plate (easier on a hardboat than a RIB) and slip your other arm in. Take the weight of the system and let it settle. The crotch strap and waist straps can now be found and attached.

If this is still a struggle, then you may have the shoulder straps a little tight.

Hope that helps!

Rich

PS Don't worry about the stick from other divers. They're just jealous ;)

Woz
03-12-09, 12:17 PM
Cheers Rich

We were on Clutha (hardboat) and I meant clipping the spg back on was a bit of a struggle the 1st few times, getting in and out of the harness was ok really i'm glad I'd read up about it first.

Dave
When deflating your wing ready to get out of it and back into the RIB, make sure you hold onto your set if it's a bit rough as there is nothing sadder than a man sobbing after 3000 worth of Euro cylinders, Halcyon hardware, regs and HID lights go plummeting to the depths.

Digger
03-12-09, 12:42 PM
When deflating your wing ready to get out of it and back into the RIB, make sure you hold onto your set if it's a bit rough as there is nothing sadder than a man sobbing after 3000 worth of Euro cylinders, Halcyon hardware, regs and HID lights go plummeting to the depths.

Just leave the bungeed necklace to last. Then you never forget, and if you do, you learn a really quick lesson :)

Woz
03-12-09, 12:45 PM
Just leave the bungeed necklace to last. Then you never forget, and if you do, you learn a really quick lesson :)What, how strong tie-wraps are?

Digger
03-12-09, 12:52 PM
What, how strong tie-wraps are?

Believe me, you will sink before they break.

Digs.

Woz
03-12-09, 12:57 PM
Believe me, you will sink before they break.

Digs.
Brilliant. Being dragged to the depths by my neck. What a great day... :)

stephensoncj
03-12-09, 03:15 PM
Davy,

the straps need to be a lot looser than you would think to make donning and doffing easy, the waist strap joins it all together... don't be fooled into making the shoulder sraps any where as tight as you would with a normal jacket or wing combo.

setting hte right length takes some time, moving the straps up and down but once set it should be easy even to take off in the water. I dive regually off a Rib and I am sure many other do.

-- If they take the pi** too much you can always swap clubs :omg: one just down the road has a few DIR type divers (but with barrels instead of 6 packs):wink:

Chris

davydiver
03-12-09, 04:06 PM
Thanks chris il stick with this club for now as I'm DO and been there 14 years!

stephensoncj
03-12-09, 09:38 PM
no problem :teeth:


chris