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One Team One Dream
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Im looking at replacing a 2nd stage Apex XTX 40 and with this change I was looking at using it as a stage reg paired with DS4.

But what has bugged me is that

XTX 40 plain £112 ish



XTX 40 Octo £133



XTX 40 Nitrox £173



Now the above pictures have been taken from reputable Dive shops

But come on to change a face plate from Black to Green/Blue does not cost £61 and a little bit of crysto-lube on the moving parts.
 

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I once asked a well-known dive shop to supply me with a plain atx40 / ds4, but o2 clean it before they sent it to me. They wouldn't do it..
 

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Jesus don't want me for a sunbeam
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It happens all the time, a manufacturer sells the same product under different names, one comes with a certificate that says it's suitable for [...whatever...] and is 30% more expensive even though it's exactly the same as the standard range. If you need the cert then they know you have to pay but equally they're providing a warranty that says it will do what you want it to.

It always amuses me that Apeks put in a cleanroom to do the same work that a dive shop does on an old bench in the back room in amongst the pasty crumbs and Greggs bags. They could have saved themselves a fortune and knocked 50 quid off the price.
 

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I've got £105, £129 and £143 respectively but your point is still valid. The only thing I'll say in defence is that if you're ordering parts for 2000 standard second stages, and 1500 octopus second stages and 700 nitrox stages you'll find that a part that might cost you 50p on the 2000 standard stages might cost you £1.50 on the 700 nitrox stages just because it's a different colour.

I know that one of the parts my company manufacture costs £200 for our standard product. The part which is almost identical but has a production run in 50s rather than 100s costs three times as much because set up and tooling costs are the same. It's like when I get brochures printed. 1000 brochures cost about £50 more than 500 brochures but 500 brochures might cost £350!
 

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Fettlin'
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I don't understand what the issue is?

The standard XTX40 is the highest volume seller and, therefore, the lowest cost. I would expect Apeks make fewer octopus regs so the yellow parts may cost marginally more, it also comes complete with a hose (not included with the standard reg above).

The 'green' reg is put together in Apek's dedicated O2 clean area and this requires further costs to set up and equip over the assembly of the standard regs. Their nitrox regs come issued as suitable for 100% oxygen out of the box which reflects this higher assembly standard.

It's up to the customer to decide whether or not they actually NEED to pay the extra.

I have loads of Apeks regs for stages but none of them are 'green'; I don't like the colour:wink:
 

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One Team One Dream
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Scuttler I understand the manufacturing costs Vs Volume

MJS can you prove this statement
The 'green' reg is put together in Apek's dedicated O2 clean area
I have to agree with NotDeadYets comments about the old work bench.

So lets get this straight XTX 40 Nitrox is assembled in a clean room with people wearing

and I will pay £30ish for a piece of paper that lasts until the next service.

Ken Hawk I have no problem with my LDS making a profit or others I actually Help out in one when the owner is training students.
 

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Just get some Atomic regs! They only have one price per model, none of this crap that other manufacturers do. They are bullet proof and worth every penny. I have 3 sets of them for me and my wife, afterall it's not an area to skimp on!
 

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I don't understand what the issue is?

The standard XTX40 is the highest volume seller and, therefore, the lowest cost. I would expect Apeks make fewer octopus regs so the yellow parts may cost marginally more, it also comes complete with a hose (not included with the standard reg above).

The 'green' reg is put together in Apek's dedicated O2 clean area and this requires further costs to set up and equip over the assembly of the standard regs. Their nitrox regs come issued as suitable for 100% oxygen out of the box which reflects this higher assembly standard.

It's up to the customer to decide whether or not they actually NEED to pay the extra.

I have loads of Apeks regs for stages but none of them are 'green'; I don't like the colour:wink:
:thumbs_up:
 

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Fettlin'
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414 Posts
MJS can you prove this statement
The 'green' reg is put together in Apek's dedicated O2 clean area
No I can't because it is not my responsibility to monitor their assembly process; I have, however, seen the clean area and I have dealt with the company since the 90s so I have a pretty good idea whether or not they can provide what they claim.

Steve has highlighted, above, the more important point of my original post; most of the 'oxygen clean' deco regs that I get asked to service are thoroughly minging when I open them up - I usually find salt deposits, corrosion, debris, mould and even creatures from time to time.:D And they still seem to work.
 

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Most of you can all rebuild the engine from your car in a shed but it does not mean that they are first assembled in a clean area to limit the chance of contamination when first produced.
A lot of cars run on pure Oxygen in Europe do they?

Also, just like there is a difference between the Apeks clean room and the pie crust covered bench out the back of a LDS - there is a big difference in the cleanliness found in a true 'engine builder' vs. a mechanic or engine reconditioner.

The Mercedes garage near me looks cleaner than my office, yet the mechanic round the corner from me does exactly the same work, for half the price. You pays your money and you takes you choice;)
 

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Jesus don't want me for a sunbeam
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A lot of cars run on pure Oxygen in Europe do they?

Also, just like there is a difference between the Apeks clean room and the pie crust covered bench out the back of a LDS - there is a big difference in the cleanliness found in a true 'engine builder' vs. a mechanic or engine reconditioner.

The Mercedes garage near me looks cleaner than my office, yet the mechanic round the corner from me does exactly the same work, for half the price. You pays your money and you takes you choice;)
Clean environments was one of the main things my old company did, most new modern engineering factories are built to standards that are better than a lot of hospitals. One of my clients made paintballs, they were produced in a pharmaceutical plant alongside cold remedies and other drugs, doesn't get much cleaner than that.

It doesn't mean that someone in a garage somewhere can't do a similar piece of work but if contamination control is important to whatever the process is then you get what you pay for.
 

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Before forking out on an O2 clean 2nd stage, why not ask "How the bloody hell am I going to keep this thing O2 clean?".

I don't think it's possible is it? So if you're really bothered, you'll be doing a hell of a lot of cleaning.
 
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