YD Scuba Diving Forums banner

1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
do you hear boats?...I hear boats
Joined
·
262 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi,

I've been looking at some inflation devices that would work with the Dragon/Farr Harness, similar in principal to that of Brian's "Scoff Bag" approach and thought it might be worth showing you guys.

Have found a few alternatives below. My ideal solution is for something that fits into and is flush with the small of the back/spine keeping the divers profile as low as possible and avoiding what some people have been calling "the camel's hump".

Note: Some are complete systems, some you can buy just the inflator portion to combine with existing kit.

I'd appreciate any info on other alternatives to what I have found and if you have used any of these systems, know of someone who has or have any observations let me know.

Here is my list:

Side mount Eques
Side Mount Eques - Krzysztof Starnawski

Hollis SMS 50 (the cheapest I have found) you need to scroll down a bit
SMS Sidemount BC by Hollis - Dive Gear Express

UTD Z mount (just the floaty bit)
UTD Online Store - +1 206 321-0870 - [email protected]

KAMALEONT sidemount - use Google translate if your Italian isn't up to scratch
Sidemount Kamaleont

XDeep Stealth 2.0
XDEEP Stealth 2.0 - Shop4Divers RAAJON


I've not included any of the numerous DSS wings in the above that you can find here:

https://www.deepseasupply.com/index.php?category=wings

As in my view they are similar to the (perfectly good) Scoff Bag approach - thought it might be of use to somebody.
 

·
do you hear boats?...I hear boats
Joined
·
262 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yeah - have done that with my old tekwing (lite) and it's good, just looking at alternatives...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
I've done a few dozen dives using the Farr harness and the UTD Z-system wing (the large 21 litre one). The wing is quirky but it works.

The wing has velcro straps that go around the shoulder straps. It also has a tunnel along the center axis of the wing. First I attach a double ender on the Farr harness. There are two convenient metal rings at shoulder height on the back for that. Then I attach a crotch strap (webbing, triglides) on that and thread it through the wing and the wings lower triglide. I also connect the harness back strap and the crotch strap at the lower back. When the crotch strap is suitably tightened, then the wing stays there nicely.

If I inflate the wing, it tends to float (surprise?). The velcro flaps may slide back. That's why I got XS Scuba weight pockets (with velcro attachment). By placing these weight pockets between the Y crossing of the harness and the velcro straps, I can prevent the harness from sliding back and I also get nice trim weights that help me stay horizontal. The weight pockets must be secured with bungee, though. Else they may open in certain situations.

The lower corners of the wing must also be attached to the waist belt. Use some bungee and bolt snaps for that. Triglides with 90 degree low profile D-rings may be of use...

I will be in Crickhowell and at SWCC 7th -15th July so I can show this setup if you happen to be around...

________
Does it work? Well.. yes and no... The wing is good for backup buoyancy (I have a drysuit) and I also inflate it on the surface when I want to swim on my back. Below the surface it may be a bit difficult to dump - maybe due to lacking skill? I need to rotate a bit and sometimes I even need to turn belly up to dump the wing. Not elegant, really. This issue might be gone however, if I learn to use the rear dump properly.
 

·
Infinity
Joined
·
81 Posts
sorry ralf. what are u goin on about? the razor harness is a all in1 harness bar the T weight system and the bat wing which are easy to fix on - this is by far one of the best if not best sidemount harness on the market. here is a example of a swimming harness doing a 6 cylinder dive :) - enjoy

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
Yeah, I but what if you need to walk? Does the Razor harness split the load between the waist and the shoulders? How does it work on land? Haven't tried.

There are two types of side mount harness: the ones where the shoulder straps go straight down and the ones where the shoulder straps join at the back. I wonder how this affects usability.

I'd love to try the Razor, though. It has some impressive features (e.g. a nice wing).


ps. What is that rear B-ring for? Why two loops?
 

·
Infinity
Joined
·
81 Posts
i always walk to site in mine and put my cylinders on in the water, great thing about sidemount - get your cylinders to the water with ease rather than struggle along. if u r on a boat ou can safety clip wth top (neck) of the cylinder and fix as normal the bottom - this way u dont put un-needed stretch and tension on bungee, simply drop down shot line, unclip and fix bungee on - simples :) - the rear b-ring as u put it is for safety reels/spools/primary reel/markers etc - there is also 2 other rings further apart to clip on the expandable pouch. trust me it is as easy as it comes with a little practice
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
Does anybody know if it's possible to get the Razor harnesses break away regulator clips in Europe? They cost $10/piece, but postage from U.S. is $50... I'd like to test those...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
I'll probably give the Razor harness a try in the autumn. If it feels good I might even invest in the bat wing.

Never used any system where the straps go under the arms... :D
 

·
Membership Cancelled
Joined
·
980 Posts
With a harness you can cave in with cylinders attached, there's a lot to be said for wearing a old style horse collar ABLJ over your harness. Alternatively you can turn a stab jacket into a comfortable sidemount harness. Both have the advantage of not putting anything much across your back where it doesn't want to be for sidemount.

If you are diving in drysuit then using the suit alone as for bouyancy is the preferred option either one of the two options above (or a Scoff bag) can be employed as back up but ordinarily kept deflated and out of the way.
 

·
Membership Cancelled
Joined
·
980 Posts
i always walk to site in mine and put my cylinders on in the water, great thing about sidemount - get your cylinders to the water with ease rather than struggle along. if u r on a boat ou can safety clip wth top (neck) of the cylinder and fix as normal the bottom - this way u dont put un-needed stretch and tension on bungee, simply drop down shot line, unclip and fix bungee on - simples :) - the rear b-ring as u put it is for safety reels/spools/primary reel/markers etc - there is also 2 other rings further apart to clip on the expandable pouch. trust me it is as easy as it comes with a little practice
That's not always an option in a cave. How would you propose carrying your cylinders between sumps? One at a time?

In many circumstances clipping anything else to your harness would be an entanglement hazard.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
About clipping: Last week I hand holded a 7 litre cylinder in a cave as I was too afraid of diving with a side mounted cylinder. I feared that the cylinder might wedge itself between the not-so-smooth cave walls and I might not be able to free it or cut it off. The fact that maximum depth of this awkward duck was ½m and length only 1m would not have comforted, if I had got stuck. And no, I did not have dangling stuff on D-rings. Nothing. The whole concept of clipping things to a rear D-ring is a bit... scary...

But still... the bat wing is an interesting device (wasn't this thread about bcds?).
 

·
do you hear boats?...I hear boats
Joined
·
262 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Ralf - I'm just looking to collate as many wing/floation devices as people know about (CE rated or otherwise) - I've not added any home build stuff as of yet, the items I quite like the look of is the floation part of the Eques Side Mount Eques - Krzysztof Starnawski - it's used in OW and I like the idea of being able to take it off without having to remove my harness, if I need to.

But I also fancy getting a metre or so of cordura, a water bag and some niknaks off old BCDs and making "something".

The Kamaleont Side Mount System Kamaleont (flotation part) looks interesting (almost the same as the small UTD Z but appears to be better made) and I know that's been used in OW as well.

I'm looking at something that will be good for OW as well as in cave as there are a number of submerged holes located along the NW coast of Scotland which people have looked into but not actually ventured into.

So just gathering as much info as I can at the moment.
 

·
Infinity
Joined
·
81 Posts
That's not always an option in a cave. How would you propose carrying your cylinders between sumps? One at a time?

In many circumstances clipping anything else to your harness would be an entanglement hazard.
totally agree with what you are saying Duncan, i am only speaking from my own point of view....in the UK i enjoy diving mines more than caves, i have no great interest in dry caving therefore choose mines over caves, when i go away though my options increase ten fold :) - The razor works for me for sure but for someone like yourself i am sure you have found your perfect set up
 

·
Infinity
Joined
·
81 Posts
why do you think it is so good when compared to the other market offerings ?

why is it better for UK cave diving than a dragon or farrworld harness ?
sorry, i am a diver (cave) not a caver (dry) and the razor is by far the best on the market - simple and minimal, the razor holds your tanks very close to you and in a streamlined manner. Buyoncey and trim are a important factor to my diving where as some UK cave diving this is not as important (dry caving from sump to sump). i have dived the mentioned harness and they are not close to what the razor will offer you when trained correctly to dive it
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
678 Posts
With a harness you can cave in with cylinders attached, there's a lot to be said for wearing a old style horse collar ABLJ over your harness. Alternatively you can turn a stab jacket into a comfortable sidemount harness. Both have the advantage of not putting anything much across your back where it doesn't want to be for sidemount.

If you are diving in drysuit then using the suit alone as for bouyancy is the preferred option either one of the two options above (or a Scoff bag) can be employed as back up but ordinarily kept deflated and out of the way.
there are quite a few suggestions over on cave diver forum utilsing a bcd over a basic side mount harness. hell, it even inspired me to have a go! If its good enough for Forest Wilson, its good enough for us lowly YD mortals. have look here: New Sidemount harness.

and here's forest with his OW styley bcd over a simple harness: New Sidemount harness.

i understand where irnbru is coming from. for those that can be bothered it's an interesting experience exploring the different tweaks and options one can make to sidemount.

anyway. using a bcd over a sidemount harness can save oneself a hell of a lot of money. new hollis SM50 and custom divers 'rhino' are all around the £499 mark.
 

·
do you hear boats?...I hear boats
Joined
·
262 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Nice one - like the MSR bag horizontally in the small of the back like that, lots of good stuff here :)

Have seen it used vertically before, might just give the horizontal one a go. Another later post references back to sump4...it's all swings and roundabouts
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Top