[672]

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firstly greetings to the forum!!! i would like to ask the forum a question regarding spare air/pony. after recently passing my advanced course and hopeing within the next 4 weeks to take my speciality deep diver i wondered if you guys at the forum had a tips or deals i should be looking for as regards to the spare air? i would rather use it as a stage hung from my side rather than it banded to my main cylinder, now i have seen a package that i would like but wondered if u guys had an angle on this equiptment bearing in mind it would have to be envioromentaly sealed to use all year round the equiptment that ive seen (NEW)is 3litre faber cylinder,pony bag, scubapro r190 mk2 regulator including o2 clean for £189 any info would be greatly recieved and thanx in advance

 

[Mary]

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<font color='#000F22'>where's that from I believe I paid £159 for the exact same thing 2 years ago.

 

[672]

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pony package this is the link mary but do u have a opinion on this product

 

[Mary]

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<font color='#000F22'>well i'm sure one of the more expererienced guys will have lots to say but it suits me the pony bag thing is crap though, not sure how the best way of side slinging is as my boobs get in the way so have mine back mounted with a CD clamp thingy, however having tried a mates twin 7s it does pull you off balance quite a bit. basically a very good (and potentially life saving) piece of kit though

 

[672]

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i have recently started diving with a technical diver of 30 years with countless number of dives and qualifications to go with it i have seen how she slings her pony on 1 side and its great!!! i dont know how much it unbalances her but she never seems to have a problem like you say its a life saving piece of kit and with me starting to go deeper i thought it could be a valuable piece of kit

 

[gblades2]

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I have recently passed my AOW aswell. Having the pony under your arm seems to be the way most technical divers recomend it being done. I would decide which way to want to do it and then buy the bottle to match.

If you put the pony on the side of the tank then it will tend to try and twist you over. You would be better off with an aluminium bottle which is more neutrally buoyant.
If you are mounting it around in front of you then you probably dont want it coming up and hitting you so perhaps a steel one would be better.
I have not yet used a pony so I cannot say what is best to use, but only point out a couple of issues that I have found out.

The description of what you are looking at sais O2 Clean which tends to imply that it is designed for high oxygen concentrations and designed to be used during deco stops. To me this seems excessive for what you need and a pony with regular first stage and regular will be cheaper and sufficient.

 

[Mark Chase]

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Hi all

First02 clean just means you can get partial pressure Nitrox fills. This is where the put some pure 02 in first and top off with air to give a mix above 21/79. If you have a Nitrox ticket than its worth getting so you can have a Nitrox mix in your pony to suit your max depth dive. IE if you are planning max 30m diving get a pony filled with Nitrox 36. This will give you a max depth bail out of 35m with an exceptional max depth of 45m and will optimise your off gassing in an emergency ascent from depth.

Pony bags are not good as they allow the thing to wobble about and often cause imbalance. Side slung is goon on many levels.

Its cheep

It allows easy access to the on off valve

It allows the reg to be stowed in such a way as to be instantly accessible whilst not being confused with other regs.

It allows the rig to be passed up to a boat for reduced weight when climbing the ladder

It allows the rig to be passed off to a diver who needs gas so he/she is not connected to you and cant drag you to the surface.

All in all it’s a good set up

Remember not to adjust weight for the pony it is a removable bit of kit so you should be able to hand it off without adversely affecting your ability to hold a stop.

Can’t think of any thing else but any questions please ask

ATB

Mark Chase

 

[John Gulliver]

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The Scubapro R190 is not a fancy reg but is very reliable. I've had one on my pony for several years, used it in water that is often as cold as around zero and never had any problems.
I'd love to have my (3L x 300 bar steel) pony slide slung but it didn't work for me, pulled me forward and downward. I therefore have it back mounted but inverted, so I can get at the valve. You need a longer (octopus length) hose to do that, though, at least I do.
Mark, the MOD for EAN 32, assuming we use the ppO2 limit of 1.4 as I believe we've all been taught, is 33 m according to my calculations.
PS Many people seem to think that a pony bag actually works very well. I've never tried it myself but it does seem to be quite secure. Perhaps someone here uses one?

 

[Simon TW]

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<font color='#000080'>I bought a pony and all the kit to go with it in September, I can't remember how much it cost but I was with Peter K in Glasgow and he chose it, It has a fantastic attachment that has been greatly admired. It clips to the main tank and in no way has it altered the way in which I perform underwater.

I feel so much better diving with a pony than I did previously, I have it rigged with my alternate reg and it's allways turned on prior to a dive.

I recently took it to the Red Sea and the group that I dived with (I was the only brit) were puzzled by it and I had to explain its purpose.

 

[sbuccilli]

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if you get unbalanced with apony why not move a bit of lead to the opposite side ,easy and it works for me.

 

[John Gulliver]

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Quote[/b] (sbuccilli @ Nov. 09 2003,19:47)]if you get unbalanced with apony why not move a bit of lead to the opposite side ,easy and it works for me.

I don't even have to do that, although, as it happens, I do have a kilo more on the left side in the summer (7 kilos altogether). In the winter I wear 8 kilos of lead, evenly balanced, as I want to be able to put more air in my suit because of the cold water. I don't notice any difference in balance compared to the summer, though.

 

[672]

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thanx for the replys guys its much appreciated your comments as it will probably sway towards buying it before i do my deep speciality down at stoney mid december by which time it will be getting cold and steam rising off the water  

 

 

[Mark Chase]

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Quote[/b] (John Gulliver @ Nov. 09 2003,17:58)]Mark, the MOD for EAN 32, assuming we use the ppO2 limit of 1.4 as I believe we've all been taught, is 33 m according to my calculations.

I actually recommended Nitrox 36 for planned max depth of 30m

Maximum Operational Depth is always shown at 1.6 pp02

Nitrox 36 at 30m is 1.44

MOD of Nitrox 36 is 36m at PP02 1.6

MOD Exceptional Exposure NOAA tables 45m pp02 2.0

NOAA exceptional exposure PP02 2.0 = 30mins

If the planned max depth is 30m 36 will cover you for ASCENT ONLY down to 45m in an emergency.

It takes two minutes for PP02 to fully affect the body. If you had an emergency that took you to 45m and you had to bail to a pony you would have two mins before the PP02 of 2 took effect and I would hope you had risen some way up in the water by then or you wont make the surface on a 3 ltr.

ATB

Mark Chase

 

[And]

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Quote[/b] (Mark Chase @ Nov. 09 2003,23:03)]If the planned max depth is 30m 36 will cover you for ASCENT ONLY down to 45m in an emergency.

It takes two minutes for PP02 to fully affect the body. If you had an emergency that took you to 45m and you had to bail to a pony you would have two mins before the PP02 of 2 took effect and I would hope you had risen some way up in the water by then or you wont make the surface on a 3 ltr.

<font color='#000080'>Hi

I'd love to see an emergency which took you down to 45 mtrs in stoney

Seriously, the guy is doing his deep (air) diver speciality and is asking about whether a pony package is suitable. Lets not hijack the thread with the usual disaster stories and obscure hypothetical justifications for bad gas choice

(36% to 45m FFS! )

Back to the matter at hand, I do not agree with ponies personally and I would not recommend the package you mention. SDS do an Apeks TX40/DS4 setup for £125, a far better reg for UK conditions. A pony will be about £70. If you are going to get one then thats the best option. Thankfully the reg can still be used later on should you decide to progress further.

I do not see why you need a deep diver speciality. Taking a nitrox course will give the same level of qualification and be much better and stand you in good stead for future diving.

Hope that helps

Andy

 

[John Gulliver]

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Quote[/b] (Mark Chase @ Nov. 10 2003,00:03)]

Quote[/b] (John Gulliver @ Nov. 09 2003,17:58)]Mark, the MOD for EAN 32, assuming we use the ppO2 limit of 1.4 as I believe we've all been taught, is 33 m according to my calculations.

I actually recommended Nitrox 36 for planned max depth of 30m

Maximum Operational Depth is always shown at 1.6 pp02

Nitrox 36 at 30m is 1.44

MOD of Nitrox 36 is 36m at PP02 1.6

MOD Exceptional Exposure NOAA tables 45m pp02 2.0

NOAA exceptional exposure PP02 2.0 = 30mins

If the planned max depth is 30m 36 will cover you for ASCENT ONLY down to 45m in an emergency.

It takes two minutes for PP02 to fully affect the body. If you had an emergency that took you to 45m and you had to bail to a pony you would have two mins before the PP02 of 2 took effect and I would hope you had risen some way up in the water by then or you wont make the surface on a 3 ltr.

ATB

Mark Chase

Different agencies, different recommendations, apparently, Mark.
CMAS teach MOD at ppO2 1.4. MOD for EAN 36 is thus 28m (actually 28.88 but we are taught to round off downwards, in the same way as we are taught to round off analyser readings upwards – if your analyser reads 35.2% you are on EAN 36).
I see your point about nitrox for ascent but that's presumably more in the realm of advanced nitrox. In any event, it's not part of my training. I'm only trained to use nitrox as a bottom gas, not for accelerated deco, so I'll stick to air in my pony.

 

[Lou]

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Quote[/b] ]I do not see why you need a deep diver speciality. Taking a nitrox course will give the same level of qualification and be much better and stand you in good stead for future diving.

Are you sure about that?  I still haven't worked that one out yet.  The TDI course qualifies you to use EANx up to 40% for dives down to 40m, but I don't know whether it actually qualifies you to dive to 40m.

One way of understanding it is that it qualifies the gas, not the dive.

Any further info?

Lou

 

[Dominic]

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That's pretty much what I had as my first pony package. The bag was fine, so long as you put it RIGHT up against your back so it couldn't wobble. The reg was perfectly reliable, no problems with it. Paid £170..

Incidentally, a pony isn't a spare air - a spare air is a worthless gadget sold mainly to gullible American OW divers. You demean your noble pony by referring to it by such a name

 

[John Gulliver]

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Interesting point, Lou! On a somewhat broader note, PADI, like most agencies, places the limit for sport diving at 40 m. But how do you actually qualify to dive to 40 m? As far as I can see, there is no way to qualify formally to dive to more than 30 m under the PADI system, at least not up to the level to which I'm qualified (Divemaster). Rather, it seems up to you to decide when you're qualified to go over the 30 m limit. Odd!

 

[tom]

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Quote[/b] (John Gulliver @ Nov. 10 2003,13:01)]As far as I can see, there is no way to qualify formally to dive to more than 30 m under the PADI system,

PADI deep specialty qualifies you to 40, doesn't it?

http://www.padi.com/english/common/courses/rec/continue/deepdiver.asp

 

[Lou]

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John

The Deep Diver speciality qulaifies to you 40m under PADI.  Hence the point WL made, and my subsequent query.

WL suggested, as far as I understood it, that the nitrox qual woudl do all the deep diver does (ie qual you to dive to 40m) with the added advantage of not teaching you to do it on air!

Lou